CAD

Microstation has a true auto save. It writes to the drive upon ever key stroke. Therefore you can work all day without hitting save and if the power went out you would not loose a single key stroke.

Microtation is a true 64 bit application which handles very large files and many references with ease.

Microstation does NOT change the file format every year to force customers into an upgrade.?ÿ

I think you can still buy a perpetual license for Microstation.?ÿ

Much easier to customize your CAD standards with MS.

Many DOTs started using Intelligrapgh on 64 bit UNIX computers with dual monitors in 1960-70s. It was used by NASA to go to the moon. In 1985 Bentley brothers created a PC version of Intergraph calling it Microstation. AutoDesk has been trailing behind ever since, in resent years catching up fast, soon they may be in the lead.

@leegreen?ÿ

I just got trained for two weeks and no one mentioned any of that.?ÿ Thanks for the back story. That would have been really nice to be told as the introduction to the product.

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Microstation has been the go-to for DOT projects, in fact if you're an engineering firm doing DOT work it's a requirement. I found it very clunky for doing day to day surveying tasks.?ÿ

As DOT projects dried up for local engineers they moved away from microstation and are full on Autocad shops.?ÿ

They keep microstation around in case the days of large DOT design projects return.

It was always simple to send them data out of autocad to merge with a microstation file so we never took the plunge.?ÿ

From what I've been told it's way better for highway design.?ÿ

Posted by: @leegreen

"AutoDesk has been trailing behind ever since,"

Please elaborate...

Posted by: @leegreen

Microstation does NOT change the file format every year to force customers into an upgrade.?ÿ

Much easier to customize your CAD standards with MS.

AutoCAD and C3d have maintained the same file format for the last 6 editions. And it can always be set to save down or even operate in older formats.

C3d is all about CAD Standards. 'Nuff said.

So, yes, ACAD is quickly catching up.?ÿ ?ÿ

DOT is about the only Microstation shop around here. As a result the pool of MS capable CAD technicians is pretty shallow.?ÿ If the DOT tires of training every hire it will evaporate altogether.?ÿ

Posted by: @leegreen

. AutoDesk has been trailing behind ever since,

Technologically, perhaps.

But from a market share viewpoint, not so much.

Quick search show Autodesk with 37% market share and microstation 0.53%. Of course that 37% includes all the Autodesk products.

The last couple of years, Autodesk has focused on construction, with acquisitions and product enhancements. I'd bet on Autodesk.

Stock price is hovering around just under $200, currently rated as a "buy" stock.

What I've always told people who want to learn both:

AutoCAD is more user friendly but Microstation is way more powerful (now I think they're pretty close).

Microstation was designed by engineers. So you have to have all of your ducks in a row before you hit the "go" button and if one of those ducks gets out of line the function doesn't work how you planned and sometimes the error message isn't much help. Plus the amount of variables used to configure Microstation is quite daunting, especially if you're new to the product.

Yeah Microstation vs. AutoCad arguments are right up there with:

• Trucks - Chevy vs. Ford
• Cowboy hats - Black vs. White
• Hay bales - Round vs. Square

The correct answers are Ford, black, and round. And AutoCad of course.?ÿ

Back in the day when I used MicroStation exclusively,?ÿ I thought it was the bomb.?ÿ All of the work was DOT/FHWA and it handled long strip files of roadways.?ÿ Some where 14 miles long.?ÿ AutoCad would bog down with such large files.

Now, I have been using C3D for smaller sites and it's ok to use.?ÿ To me, it's a matter of what you get used to.?ÿ Going back and forth between the platforms is time consuming.?ÿ Pick one and run with it.

@blitzkriegbob?ÿ

Chevy, white and round if feeding but square if selling

Posted by: @leegreen

Microstation has a true auto save. It writes to the drive upon ever key stroke. Therefore you can work all day without hitting save and if the power went out you would not loose a single key stroke.

Microtation is a true 64 bit application which handles very large files and many references with ease.

Microstation does NOT change the file format every year to force customers into an upgrade.?ÿ

I think you can still buy a perpetual license for Microstation.?ÿ

Much easier to customize your CAD standards with MS.

Do you still use it? It does not save with every keystroke , partly because you canƒ??t press a key for commands, but it can save every 3 seconds or disable auto save. I disable auto save because at times I get into a DGN with the intention of not making revisions to not save. Auto save would save when no work was done making it appear to others that someone did work in the file.?ÿ

microstation itself now is old, as their current product is openroads designer which is more autocad like. And yes it has versions that make saving in a new version that is not compatible with the previous version. ?ÿORD is slower at things than geopak/microstation was.?ÿ

Posted by: @leegreen

Microstation has a true auto save. It writes to the drive upon ever key stroke. Therefore you can work all day without hitting save and if the power went out you would not loose a single key stroke.

So does Autodesk.?ÿ It stores it all current in a "recovery file"

Microtation is a true 64 bit application which handles very large files and many references with ease.

Autodesk has been "true 64 bit", taking full advatnage of the massive RAM availability, since 2008

Microstation does NOT change the file format every year to force customers into an upgrade.?ÿ

Yeah.?ÿ This sucks.?ÿ Autodesk sucks.?ÿ They cycle between helping the user and haling the shareholder - mostly bending over to the latter.

I think you can still buy a perpetual license for Microstation.?ÿ

2020 versions were the last of that for autodesk, which is why I'll be running with those for as long as possible.

Much easier to customize your CAD standards with MS.

Not sure what you mean by easier.?ÿ Menu customization is has been built in forever and given a decent UI?ÿ in the last 12-15 years, macros and macro recording have been there since probably?ÿ 2000 (I don't use them), autoloading of lisps and vlx customizations are a 3 click process and if you know or understand lisp, you can make it do anything (which is what I do).

Many DOTs started using Intelligrapgh on 64 bit UNIX computers with dual monitors in 1960-70s. It was used by NASA to go to the moon. In 1985 Bentley brothers created a PC version of Intergraph calling it Microstation. AutoDesk has been trailing behind ever since, in resent years catching up fast, soon they may be in the lead.

Bentley virtually gave away their licenses to DOTs in order to corner civil design for years then stated billing agencies exorbitant fees for the modules.?ÿ Exactly like an crack dealer.?ÿ It sorta worked but Autodesk got so powerful, offering good discounts for corporate licensing, adding cool shiny objects to their design capabilities and gobbling up little guys and either relegating them to history or incorporating them into their suites, that they saturated the rest of everything else around civil design.

It great that there's some competition, but Bentley hasn't been enough of that to stop the desk from becoming the gorilla, I don't think ever to be toppled.?ÿ And unfortunately they know it.?ÿ I don't know how Microstation is with parametric, real time visual design?ÿ for civil, MEP , and building (BIM), but that's been a game changer in the last 15-20 years in surface modeling, drainage analysis, infrastructure design and architectural concept to finish.?ÿ Whoever continues to effectively bring those into VR and machine automation will certainly lead the future.?ÿ Right now autodesk holds that baton, but you do pay for it and sometimes complacency and feeding the shareholders can bite you inn the ass.

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It serves it purpose, which is strictly DOT work.?ÿ In 30+ years I've never met anyone that used MicroStation willingly?ÿ They are only forced to because the DOTs require it. That should tell you a lot.?ÿ If I have to use it again, it's too soon.

I traded in my Autocad 2.1 license for Microstation.?ÿ I first started in Microstation 2.x in the late 80's and stayed with them.?ÿ I do like the fact that I can open all my old Microstation files. We?ÿhave a perpetual Microstation and 2 perpetual Power InRoads licenses we use daily.?ÿ No DOT.?ÿ

You know what is good about all this CAD stuff is that we were able to purge 90% of our paper files as the field and design data is digitally archived and supporting recorded data is available online.

@blitzkriegbob I agree Ford Black but i like money so small squares because i get more money for them. ?ÿ