ROBOT

I cant give a recent opinion on the models etc as we have a 5 yr old Sokkia SRX3. It works just fine but the newer ones would be much better.

As for whether or not to purchase a robot, go for it. The ability to have a one person field crew for appropriate jobs is a time and money saver that you will not regret.

I like Leica guns, 1200 series and more recent for robotic. If your work is pretty wide open you could go as far back as the 1100 series but they will probably stop supporting those pretty soon.

My experience is limited however, it seems these things are kind of regional. The most popular set up out here in Western Washington seems to be Leica 1200 series guns run with Carlson SurvCE on a Alegro brand DC.

My impression is that out on the East Coast Trimble has captured more of the market.

I used a older topcon robot that was garbage.

I have my own business and I wouldn’t want to do it without a robot.

I have been very pleased with my Leica 1100 and 1200. I think my next will be a TS12

That is why we went with buying a robot. It was either hire an employee and deal with the BS and pay taxes, etc, etc, or get a ROBOT and no worries other than making the payments. We are testing out the S3 (well... not now... darn snow). I am really liking it.

[msg=227511]related thread[/msg]

what kind of work?

construction staking - great
open site topo - great

traverse - poor

If you're jobs require few setups or setups with long duration and not a lot of traverse, robots are great. unless you are only doing staking, I'd insist on reflectorless. saves a lot of steps, especially for a solo act.

Likewise. Joined this civil company recently after taking a year off- under the understanding that I'd be doing ALL the field work, and we'd have a dedicated cad guy and an occasional-to-regular field helper as work required. We had a starting budget to either hire a permanent field guy and go conventional, or else a robot. The decision was made that a single years' salary for equipment that would last for multiple years was a better value. I had limited experience- but some- with robots about 10 years ago, and the learning curve was shallow then. Here I shopped an RTK/robot package from the leica, trimble, and topcon stores (based on network coverage). The prices were a wash, basically- I went with leica 1. because of a longstanding personal relationship with the rep and 2. past experience with their gear. I'm sure the other gear would have been adequate, too, as I've used it as well.

I've been running a TS12 for two months now. ZERO complaints. After a couple weeks getting my, uh, beerlegs with it, I can mow through stuff almost as fast as having a second guy on a conventional gun. And I've learned how to get it to find me in tight stuff a lot faster than the day I picked it up.

Paying 800 a month on it for two years, plus some nominal insurance. Any field guy you can get for 800 a month ain't gonna be worth half that, and will probably cost you double what you pay him in errors.

I have a couple friends with field experience who help out periodically when the job requires it- like rattlesnake country jobs or line cutting-heavy jobs. One benefit, I guess, of living in a town with thousands of musicians, and knowing a ton of em.

GET ONE. I have an old, old Topcon so not much help with that, but a story.
Eight years ago bought used robot. Sent crew out to do topo. When they returned at end of first day with robot I asked instrument man how he liked it, "I hate that thing, one of us is no longer needed". Being he was the one always coming in late, he knew his days were numbered.

I've been using robots since I left the comfort of a large engineering firm in 1998. I had several large airport projects where I was running crews to tie control, lights and storm drainage. The local Leica vendor lent me their first robotic setup for our 1800's and I went out as a one person crew. I was able to make almost as good time as the crews even when you included the time to learn the system. That is when I realized I could make it on my own without having to worry about feeding another family or three. Since then I have never bought anything but robotic instruments. I have gone from a solo shop to running several crews and back to solo. There have been very few, if any, projects over the years that I needed person on the gun and one on the rod.

I'm currently running Leica 1200 system guns. I have a 1201 I use on a regular basis and a 1203 which has been sitting on the shelf since I went back down to a solo operation. The only problem with the robot is the lack of someone to bull with on the long out of town work and road trips.

> Paying 800 a month on it for two years, plus some nominal insurance. Any field guy you can get for 800 a month ain't gonna be worth half that, and will probably cost you double what you pay him in errors.
>

Remember, you would still need to pay a hefty portion of that for the non robotic model.

[sarcasm]thank God for starving liberal arts majors..... [/sarcasm]:-P

Most insurance companies require someone to guard the robot.

> what kind of work?

Roger that Shawn!!

> construction staking - great
Doing that with 2 goes way faster than 3 in a TS setup was my experience.
I would go so far to say 2 man staking is faster than solo. That was my personal experience. As the steak scribe and pounder I just couldn't keep up with the rodman but we damn sure we going lots faster than 3 and a TS.

> open site topo - great
Giant 10-4 on that!!

> traverse - poor
Agreed. A solo guy might go set a front-site point that looks fine from the rod but the gun might be shooting through leaves or fence wires. If there is traffic around the solo rodman would have no idea the gun locked on to a parked car tail-light or that obligatory traffic sign just over his shoulder - unless you have that 2nd set of eyeballs watching what the gun is actually looking at. Been burned on that more than once.

> If you're jobs require few setups or setups with long duration and not a lot of traverse, robots are great. unless you are only doing staking, I'd insist on reflectorless. saves a lot of steps, especially for a solo act.
Ditto on the reflectorless - especially where heavy traffic is involved. One afternoon I shot well over 1000' of 5 lanes of a heavily trafficked road and never stepped one foot away from my setup. That included all paint stripes, signal lights, utility poles (with line-work), drop inlets and pretty much anything else I could see that was relevant. The only time I had to hoof it on the rod was to get curb gutter on my side of the street.
Besides time and less labor cost, I would add a BIG giant plus on the safety factor alone in that situation.

No one mentioned this yet, but consider one those of those smart-target/active prism (or whatever they are called) instead of the plain ole passive 360 prism. If the gun of choice likes to loose lock, especially when going in and out and around trees and such, it would probably save a lot of time. It was probably my lack of experience but it seemed like I spent more time re-establishing lock after it lost me.

E

I don't know how one can survey efficiently without a robot these days. Get a S6 with the active track prism. You will wonder why you ever had an I-man.

I have given some thought to this. We need some sort of "Goat stake" to tether the inst to. So that grab and dash folks cannot succeed. For the tripod, and inst.

N

> [sarcasm]thank God for starving liberal arts majors..... [/sarcasm]

Eventually we become the boss and buy robots for the crews 😉

The company I'm working for has several crews. Some have Topcon Robots, some have Trimble Robots, and some have Lieca Robots. The ongoing new purchases are Lieca GS15s. 'Nuff said.

"Robotic surveying" is not necessarily synonymous with "1 person crew". There are plenty of ways a two person crew can still be effective with a robot. Jobs have needs other than data collection. The second guy can be working with RTK while the first robots. And sometimes, in certain circumstances, it is more efficient to operate these things in 2 man mode. Or one person can stay in the office today if that makes sense.

bingo. i won't give up sketching in a field book, no matter how comprehensive the capabilities of the DC are or become. one guy sketches, the other guy fires up the robot and starts shooting. one guy shoots trees, the other guy measures and tags them. basically, eliminating what once may have been overkill with two guys by taking one out of the equation and putting him into production. i can sketch a site by myself, tape most of it in by myself, tag and measure trees by myself. the guy that used to just stand there holding the other end of the tape is now being used much more effectively.

I LOVE our robot. We have two to three crews, depending on how many ways we want to break up on any given days (actually the ability to run four directions if need be) and the robot helps make it happen.

The biggest thing I found, early on, was the need to set a corner and I couldn't proceed with finishing the job until I made sure the corners were set (we don't let paperwork out until the corners are set in case one falls in concrete or whatever). Then, I didn't have to wait for crew availability and set it by myself.

I set GPS control on an as-built of a college in half a day, then as-built the small private college in 4 1/2 more days, all by myself. Topo, nothing finer. Construction layout you ask, well, we laid a few buildings out the old way and ran the levels to set the building up right. Then we went in with the robot and checked (we have a Trimble VX and it's a 1" robot). I found nothing more than 0.015' out. We don't do layout now with chains anymore. It's all radial and then checked radially from two other spots and it's still faster.

A two man robot crew can eat a job up. Lot jobs where my dad and I don't have much going on, he runs the notes and I run the rod and I try to swamp him. They go VERY quickly.

I highly recommend the purchase of one. It only goes to augment your business model.

Now with our R10 and our VX, it's insane the amount of productivity we have. My dad can run the R10, I run the VX and I still have two crews elsewhere.