What is you preferred method of resetting destroyed property corners in a situation like this.
I have a 2 acre property that I am surveying.?ÿ All property corners have been recovered except for one that was set in the middle of a 20' rocked road, over a culvert that accommodates a small stream.?ÿ This road portion has been washed out several times due to the frequent hurricanes that visit eastern NC.?ÿ Unfortunately, due to terrain, there is no line of sight to any other corners.?ÿ There road clearing is the only skyward view as it traverses through a pine forest.?ÿ As you could imagine, this severely restricts the use of my Trimble R-8 GNSS unit.?ÿ I have 2 recorded maps (from the same surveyor) that depict the property corner.?ÿ However, that particular corner has nearly a foot difference in location between the 2 maps.?ÿ ?ÿAnd finally, the surveyor who produced said recorded maps is deceased.?ÿ ?ÿ
How would you approach this?
Thanks in advance.
How do those maps fit versus the adjoiners?
How do those maps fit versus the adjoiners?
That's another issue.?ÿ This is a large tract (600+ acres) that was a family subdivision.?ÿ There literally are no adjoining maps available because this was the first (and only) property surveyed aside from the survey of the road centerline.?ÿ So the subject property and the road centerline share an iron stake as a common monument.?ÿ Outside of that are very sketchy deed calls from a farmer (non-surveyor) that use very imprecise measurements.
A reminder to all:?ÿ This is why we get paid the big bucks.
Based on your information, there are no reference monuments to recover near the rocked road. How well do the recovered monuments fit the described courses and distances??ÿ
I think I would calculate the position of the missing monument based on what was recovered and the courses called for in the deed, then set reference monuments outside of the road bed where they would be recoverable by future surveyors.?ÿ
Regardless of whether or not NC is a mandatory recording state or not, I would record a copy of the final survey at the courthouse.
Good luck!
Not sure i fully understand your issue but split the distance between the 2 maps and set it or some kind of o/s. Your using the best available evidence with the 2 maps.
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Does one of the map distances check better with the deed distance??ÿ
Tough saying, not knowing
The same surveyor recorded a map, then some years later recorded an updated map for the same corner with slightly different results.
There aren't issues with adjoiners?
I would probably accept the second map since it's locating an existing corner and the surveyor is putting everyone on notice he has an updated "better" measurement.
Of course, I could be all wrong.
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Not sure i fully understand your issue but split the distance between the 2 maps and set it or some kind of o/s. Your using the best available evidence with the 2 maps.
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Is it the best available evidence?
Although unofficial and unscientific; I would locate as much monumentation that you have recordation for. Prepare a chaining factor based on these comparisons and develop several calculated positions of the missing corner. Angle dominant, distance dominant, adjusted, direct measure and just as that old surveyor would have done it (right or wrong and not what the deed says). From these pick one, or an average of several, that your gut sense feels is right. It??s not often that I do not hold specific pieces of reference monumentation to calculate from, but this might be one of those times. You have to believe that replacing the actual piece of monumentation was more important than setting the correct, proper or legal corner. Old and historic alone does not make a corner correct. If you want to set the corner legally, do exactly what the deeds say. If you want to set the corner mathematically, do a least square adjustment. If you want to set the corner where the corner belongs, that??s what we get paid the big bucks for.
Not that I would know anything, but just testing out a possible approach against the mountain of experience here:?ÿ This might be one of those that you talk to people who may know about the property (take notes), dig around for field books/notes, examine what deed evidence you have as far back as is reasonable vs the field measurements and possibly end up doing a PLSS style proportioning to try to get a reasonable location.?ÿ Seems like intent is what you'd try to end up basing your defense on.
As far as monumenting it, I think I'd put something solid down at the location and then place 3 'permanent' ties that would be hard to confuse with a monument around it.?ÿ Then map it all and record it.
The first thing to do is buy a Javad unit ( where are you Nate) and canopy is no problem, and secondly, buy a bigger cap that will cover the distance between the measurements in question ???? .?ÿ
?ÿ As you could imagine, this severely restricts the use of my Trimble R-8 GNSS unit.?ÿ
Tutter Tutter Tutter.
<Javad>.
Tutter Tutter Tutter
I'll admit, their software in the LS needs some improvement. But, I still believe that they have the most solid system, for good data in the woods.
I have in fact become kind of a thorn in the side of Javad and company, wanting more things done. But, their data collection is second to nobody, in bad environments.
Just as Trimble users don't listen to me, Neither does Javad listen to me.
ha!
I still carry a plumb bob.
Nate
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set in the middle of a 20' rocked road, over a culvert that accommodates a small stream
Does the stream mean anything (i.e. called out in the record)?
@dave-o?ÿ ?ÿBased on what he wrote it is. I understood it to be the original has been washed away so he has two maps showing the corners location that differ by a foot. Big deal
@james-vianna I get ya.?ÿ I was guessing that two disagreeing recorded maps (by the same surveyor!?ÿ That must have been an odd conversation in his head) are not necessarily best available unless there's been a good amount of additional investigation into the discrepancy.?ÿ Or, not really enough on their own even if they matched. Just an opinion though, and maybe I missed the discussion on what all else has been looked at.
You haven't mentioned any line of occupation, so I'm guessing that there isn't any. So it goes.?ÿ
The ideal solution would be to get the adjoiners to agree to a line, record new deeds with better dimensions, monument the line well (with some points on line added), and record the survey.?ÿ
I'm guessing that this 1 foot discrepancy isn't really significant in the mind of the owners. Probably you should select one set of dimensions or another and go with it. Challenge the next surveyor to disagree with you.?ÿ Monument well, including offset monuments that won't get washed away, and record. Make it easy for the next guy to accept your solution and let time do its magic.?ÿ ?ÿ ?ÿ?ÿ
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The first thing to do is buy a Javad unit ( where are you Nate) and canopy is no problem, and secondly, buy a bigger cap that will cover the distance between the measurements in question ???? .?ÿ
Does nobody break out the gun any more? ????
Just because I'm paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.
Measurements are not my first go-to in this type of situation. Start by identifying the first occurrence of a monument with reliance. If you don't have that, the owners need to solve the problem. Walk them through a solution they can live with and get it in the record. Any mathemagical solution you impose will probably blow up...
If I got the owners to do Agreements everytime I encountered a 1 foot discrepancy I'd have a mountain of Agreements on my desk.?ÿ Most of the time a foot doesn't mean anything to them.