Hello,
Could someone please clarify if they have had a similar experience? I need to calculate the cost for a project involving the decoding of UAV aerial imagery, with input data including an orthophoto, DEM, DTM, DSM. Specifically, the work involves extracting vertical relief features, planimetric characteristics, and creating a clean TIN surface – in simpler terms, generating 2D and 3D CAD layers for ALTA projects, topographic surveys, and DOT projects.
I understand that everyone sets their own rates and calculates differently, but, for example, I personally consider Aerotas’ pricing to be overestimated. I am well acquainted with their methodology and rates, and in my opinion, their offer is not particularly client-oriented. (This is merely my subjective view—I know very well how my colleagues operate, and if there are PLS for whom such rates work, I don’t see anything wrong with that.)
Recently, I came across the pricing structure from basemapconsulting, and their pricing matrix is, to put it mildly, quite steep:
Planimetrics:
2D or 3D polylines
Use your own layers or theirs
Delivered as a ready-to-use DWG or DXF file with all layers
Created based on an orthomosaic or LiDAR data
2D: $20 per acre, with a minimum of $500
3D: $25+ per acre, with a minimum cost of $750
Usually projects can vary significantly – it could be a right-of-way for a road, a developed urban area, a parcel for a supermarket by type Walmart with parking, an individual plot of land, or even a quarry where determining the clean surface is required. The scope of work, requirements, and pricing vary accordingly.
What's the best pricing matrix to use? I believe that, especially when working as a subcontractor, pricing should be mutually beneficial. Maybe you're willing to make a small compromise so that the hiring party can earn a bit more while still leaving a positive impression with your work
Thx
$750 for 3d mapping of 10 acres and you are thinking that is too much? Am I reading you right? IMO $7500 would be good value.
First off I'd be leary of any company offering to provide "expert surveying" without having a PLS on staff. They call themselves "experienced survey professionals" but don't mention anything about being licensed to provide such services. That's probably why they're so cheap.
Are we definitely talking about the same thing? For a 10-acre site, the client is supposed to pay $7,500 (as per "basemapconsulting" rates) for generating these layers:
X-3D-Curb-Back,
X-3D-Road-Edge,
X-3D-Centerline,
X-3D-Breakline,
X-3D-Breakline-Interpolated,
X-3D-Spot-Elev,
X-3D-Spot-Elev-Vegetated,
X-3D-Spot-Elev-Lidar,
X-3D-Topo-Lidar,
X-3D-Breakline-Lidar,
X-3D-Topo-Point,
X-3D-Topo-Vegetated,
X-3D-Topo-Rock.
What’s the big deal? This is routine work. If we’re talking about 3D modeling of buildings, facades, or roofs—that’s where things get tricky. Facades cannot be accurately reconstructed from aerial imagery alone; you need terrestrial 3D scanners. UAV LIDAR often lacks the precision required for such tasks.
Aerial photo interpretation splits into two categories:
- 2D planimetric features (horizontal details),
- 3D vertical relief features (elevation data).
This is enough to create a clean surface model and import the necessary planimetric data into your project. But you must perform ground control verification (as stated in the ASPRS Manual of Photographic Interpretation, 2nd Edition).
Thx
We can't even answer the phone for less than $500. Im with @norman-oklahoma 100%. 7500 would be a steal. We shouldn't spend money on technology to charge less, that's a terrible business model. We use technology to do work that normally costs 10K, for 6k, and keep the profit. That's a business model. Obviously there are variables but i guarantee you the landscape architect or engineer working on the back end of your project isn't charging less because they are using newer technology.
@wa-id-surveyor I appreciate your position; thank you for your response. However, I disagree with the pricing. I asked the same question in a specialized Facebook group, and Rick Jordan (CNY Drone Services) replied, and I quote: "Lol I wouldn't be in business at those rates... We run datasets of thousands of acres a piece. $20k to have you run it for us? Not viable in the slightest." In other words, I’m not the only one who thinks it’s expensive.
With one caveat: the pricing matrix from "basemapconsulting llc" isn’t mine. The purpose of this discussion was to determine the optimal pricing for PLS for this type of work, and we haven’t made any progress on that front in our discussion. Apparently, we have different views on pricing—you’re willing to pay $7,500, while I consider that too high. Ultimately, the choice is yours. I’m trying to get a handle on the pricing for a future startup, so that it’s worthwhile for PLS to work with us, especially since in our Israeli engineering services market, this work costs less.
There must be a disconnect here. Somehow we aren't talking about the same thing.
But first, on further review, it seems that I misread the pricing in the OP. It seems that the proposed minimum charge of $750 would be for 30 acres, not 10. Which only makes the outrage 3x greater.
For a PLS to fly and map such a thing one would first have to travel to and from the site. Then one would have to establish, at a minimum, several ground truth points. On 10 acres, or 30 acres, or whatever, this would take at least a few hours and probably more. Charges for time of this sort will be in the $200/hr range. Then there is the actual flying time. And don't forget the pre-flight planning time. So we get back to the office at least $1500 into it.
Now the processing time. Download. Resolve the control/check points. Process the photos. Check and reprocess as necessary. A number of hours, maybe $300/hr.
Then the mapping. I'm aware that a great deal can be done automatically, but quite a lot can't. If you are mapping hard surfaces, such as streets and curbs, all the more.
All this assumes a wide open site that requires no ground follow up. Something that just does not exist in my state. Maybe in some places in Oklahoma. Nowhere in Oregon or Washington.
Lol I wouldn't be in business at those rates...
$25/acre for 1000 acres is $25,000. Maybe you have misinterpreted his comment.
The purpose of this discussion was to determine the optimal pricing for PLS for this type of work, and we haven’t made any progress on that front in our discussion.
About $200 an hour as a bill out rate, so for $750 you could afford about four hours of my time. Any other questions?
Just because I'm paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.
original poster lives in a world I am not familiar with.
We just flew a Gravel site of about 8 acres. My drone guy did the piles for about $250 an acre. This included some ground control, flight of about 20 minutes, and calculations, photos, ect.
I can't believe there is a simpler site to do.
$20 an acre isn't possible.
Charging by the acre doesn't seem like a very good idea since you can have some pretty busy small sites. And a pricing matrix like this seems to prioritize speed over accuracy which is another vibe I don't want to get from my subs.
I'm not sure how much it should cost to process the linework for these kinds of projects, but it seems like should be more nuanced than this.
Thx
Your questions are better suited for an AI forum. There are likely a few large engineering/surveying firms that have customized the process of automating planimetric extraction of UAS data, but most of us have to perform this task manually or have no qualms paying a few hundred dollars to get a jumpstart through Aerotas.
My pricing is often tied to the client's required quality after I thoroughly understand what they intend to use the data for. Planimetric details that include breaklines for the purpose of stormwater improvements will require a great deal more QC/QA than planimetrics for the edge of a gravel haul road at a LCID landfill.
@lurker What exactly are you not familiar with? All the information I’ve written here is available online—it’s in the public domain. Just type "Aerotas" or "Basemapconsulting" into Google
@murphy Nice to meet you 🙂 So, I'm one of those engineers who, among other things, has worked on your projects
@murphy Quote: “There are likely a few large engineering/surveying firms that have customized the process of automating planimetric extraction of UAS data”. No 🙂 such algorithms do not exist 🙂 all attempts at aerial photo interpretation using automated systems or AI do not give the accuracy required by PLS 🙂 Your reasoning is sound, but it is not realistic, we tried 🙂 If you want to learn more, take the time to read the scientific papers from ASPRS, Photogrammetric Engineering and Remote Sensing (PE&RS) this topic is very well described there
Looking at Basemap Consulting, it appears their costs are based on you flying the site with your own drone, setting your own CGP, and having enough check shots to validate the work.
As for best matrix to be use, if I were to consult this work out, I'd probably just reach out to one of those India firms that will process anything for $15-$18/hr. If you have to go through the effort of doing all the manual labor, anyone's cheap CAD should suffice for you to build on/correct their work.
especially since in our Israeli engineering services market, this work costs less.
Considerably by a large factor. I would ask your questions in that market.
Unfortunately we can't help you here. We charge adequate fees for professional services. Some charge by the hour, we typically charge by the value our services bring to the project while utilizing these technologies to allow us to work more efficiently, not cheaper.