Do any of you or have you heard of anyone setting wooden stakes for missing property
corners? This is going to be a topic of discussion Thursday night at our Central Chapter of PLSO meeting.
Personally, I used to set a lath for an "approximate" corner, but stopped that questionable practice about 12 years ago.
I am aware of at least two local surveyors that still do this.
If I am in doubt or need to do more research before setting a monument, a couple of 60d spur hubs in the general vicinity works for me.
I remember surveyors that would only set wood stakes for hubs, corner locations and what ever. There stuff was hard to follow.
The company I work for has us stake out approximate corners often. Usually for the landscapers to see how far they have to sod, or for utility companies installing their conduits and whatnot
In Arizona a wood stake does not meet the definition of a monument. We had one surveyor who routinely set wood stakes, reasoning that if he didn't set a real monument he didn't have to comply with the recording law. The SBTR disabused him of that notion.
Gary Whitfield, Ark LS No 882 used to do that. It was up to the client to come and add monuments of substance.
Drove us nuts. Corners rot off, and are gone. Cannot retrace. Surveys were of the 1320' variety anyway.
He finally lost his ticket.
"Shall set appropriate monument, of substance, to preserve the location" should be in all min stds.
N
> In Arizona a wood stake does not meet the definition of a monument. We had one surveyor who routinely set wood stakes, reasoning that if he didn't set a real monument he didn't have to comply with the recording law. The SBTR disabused him of that notion.
Bruce - Thanks for your post. Here in Oregon a wood stake also does not meet the
definition of a mon. Our board (OSBEELS) took a look at this practice back in 2009,
but so far there has been no action taken by them.
During construction we mark out boundary, right of way and easement corners with hubs. We don't set them during any boundary survey...
How about staking an effective offset to PL without having confirmed or monumented the boundary?
An approximate offset to an approximate line? Hmmm....
Maybe on very rare occasions. Say during construction the monument gets knocked out and you know if you reset it will get knocked out again, but I also know where the monument was exactly.
"Approximate Corner Stakes" ???
Well now, this is an interesting subject that I thought would be clear of conflict, but I reckon I'm wrong.
We frequently stake out lots with wooden 3' "okies". Corners and lines, for fencing and landscaping. It is intended to be a "point in time" survey for an immediate action by the landowner.
I am curious what y'all do when someone wants stakes for a fence? Do you say, "Oh No, I have have to set semi-permanent markers such as iron pins and concrete monuments."
I don't see a problem with setting temporary stakes. Sure, there is fraud and people will pull stakes, relocate them, or whatever, but for the most part people respect our work.
Dtp
"Approximate Corner Stakes" ???
> I am curious what y'all do when someone wants stakes for a fence? Do you say, "Oh No, I have have to set semi-permanent markers such as iron pins and concrete monuments."
We don't stake out points on property lines unless there are existent corners of record monumenting the ends of said line.
If the corners are lost or were never set then we survey the property and establish monuments accordingly. Some surveyors here do this to circumvent recording laws, setting proper monuments, public notice for adjoining land owners, etc.
Marking positions temporarily certainly has its place, in my opinion, this practice is not one of them.
"Approximate Corner Stakes" ???
> > I am curious what y'all do when someone wants stakes for a fence? Do you say, "Oh No, I have have to set semi-permanent markers such as iron pins and concrete monuments."
>
> We don't stake out points on property lines unless there are existent corners of record monumenting the ends of said line.
>
> If the corners are lost or were never set then we survey the property and establish monuments accordingly. Some surveyors here do this to circumvent recording laws, setting proper monuments, public notice for adjoining land owners, etc.
>
> Marking positions temporarily certainly has its place, in my opinion, this practice is not one of them.
:good:
You're either pregnant or your not, right? It's either the boundary line or it's not. The public has a right to rely and believe that it is indeed the true boundary line. As Mr. Samuel stated, there's a time and place for it, but the scenario originally described is not an appropriate venue for it.
"Approximate Corner Stakes" I thought that the subject
was about setting stakes as opposed to "semi-permanent" markers?
It appeared that the concern is whether a wooden stake can portray a Property line, or were stakes only "Approximate corners."
That's what I read in the original posting.
Dtp
"Approximate Corner Stakes" I thought that the subject
> was about setting stakes as opposed to "semi-permanent" markers?
>
> It appeared that the concern is whether a wooden stake can portray a Property line, or were stakes only "Approximate corners."
>
> That's what I read in the original posting.
>
> Dtp
Yes, part of the OP was about whether to use wooden stakes in lieu of a the professional standard of more permanent monumentation. The second portion, to which several posters responded to, including myself was :
Personally, I used to set a lath for an "approximate" corner, but stopped that questionable practice about 12 years ago.
I am aware of at least two local surveyors that still do this.
I don't know anyone that sets "approximate" corners or approximate line stakes/laths.
"Approximate Corner Stakes">Glenn
I'm with you there, "Approximate" isn't in my project proposal's either, but then again, everything we do is "approximate" with allowable error 🙂
"Approximate Corner Stakes">Glenn
> I'm with you there, "Approximate" isn't in my project proposal's either, but then again, everything we do is "approximate" with allowable error 🙂
True enough. However, you and I both know that when the public sees laths/stakes, 99% of the time they will believe that those are the gospel, and will tell others that they were set by the surveyor, and they'll tell two friends, and so on, and so on...(yes, the old tv commercial)
to which I say that is not protection of the public.
"Approximate Corner Stakes" I thought that the subject
How about this guy, who gives the clients a choice of apparent corners, or monumented surveys.
Took a fellow PLS to the board for setting 120d nails with flagging for monuments on half of his projects instead of rebar and caps (among other things). It took 4 years for a ruling against him. My time: 3 weeks of research and documentation + 3 full days with the State Investigator. His fine $3000 and had to take his test again.
> .. (OSBEELS) took a look at this practice back in 2009, but so far there has been no action taken by them.
They basically concluded that the practice is legal under the Oregon law, as written. Until PLSO has the law modified, that's the way it is. They have, nevertheless, roasted a few people over the quality of the procedure used to set the wood hub temporary corners.
