My calculated position took me to a point within the NW edge of the pictured tree (trees?). Schondstedt indicated high within the base of that edge of tree, right were expected. digging at the base of the trunk was fruitless, became clear whatever is there is encompassed by the trunk of tree. The timeline all fits, the tree would have had plenty of years to grow to it's current size in the time the rod should have been set.
I tied in the the tree(s) both separately and individually (both are 14" DBH) and took the best shot I could where the rod may have been. If I were to calculate the position from the other located monuments, my calced position is within the trunk of flagged tree (though not the center of the trunk). But at the point at which the rod lies, it's actually one tree.
Advice sought on these questions:
Is that one tree or two? What should I call it on my map? Should I call for the tree, or to a metal object within the tree? Other thoughts on how to handle it?
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14" Tree at Lot Corner Found.
Identify the tree species if you can. Maybe set an iron rod on line 5' away.
Should I call for the tree, or to a metal object within the tree?
Yes
Iron signal found within base of double-trunk tree and set nail over signal to perform measurements.
Found a double trunk sugar maple, 12" and 12" with a magnetic signal in the southwesterly face, at the base.
@dougie?ÿ
Thank you, I think that best fits my vision of it. I want to encompass all I found, and did not want to have to set an offset. There's a perfectly good monument, just needed to know how to call to it.
I'm not seeing a sugar maple there, perhaps a Norway Maple
Licensed Land Surveyor
Finger Lakes Region, Upstate New York
Things I??ve done. This is not to say you should. But to add to the idea pile.?ÿ
take a rebar, and probe under the root crown. I??ve found the bar this way. And, was able to get a ccord on the shaft, but several inches down from the top.?ÿ
N
@tfdoubleyou I don't know if you should rely upon the monument, since it would probably be disturbed.?ÿ ?ÿ You can only rely on the monument if you can prove that the location has not been disturbed.?ÿ Why not set a monument on each side of the tree 5 feet from the corner, if you have sufficient evidence.
I would describe the point "Found magnetic signal in the 28 inch base with double 12 inch B.H.D. (trees) -?ÿ Assumed original monument location is disturbed by growth of tree and did not warrant killing tree to tie in a disturbed monument."?ÿ ?ÿ
I also survey in a metropolitan area where a 5,000 square foot lot can be millions dollars.?ÿ?ÿ
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@la-stevens I didn't 'need' the monument to establish the line, the other corners?ÿ were found and fit to my satisfaction. Calculating it as a lost corner the point puts me in the tree.?ÿ Fortunately this is not a millions of dollars situation... but as I know all we agree here, I believe they still deserve as good a survey. I think all parties involved, present and future, will be satisfied to call the tree the corner, I simply did not know how best to describe it.
Also, for those still interested, it was a pair of Black Walnut trees.
BRAVO?ÿ to the group.?ÿ Depending on the time between the setting of the monument and today, there may have been no tree present or there may have been a couple of spindly saplings nearby.?ÿ In any event, a proper solution has been found.
You can only rely on the monument if you can prove that the location has not been disturbed.
It is difficult to prove undisturbed.
I thought the rule was to accept it unless you had strong evidence it was disturbed.
I don't see it as a foregone conclusion that the tree disturbed it, unless you can see the rebar/pipe is leaning because of pressure from the root.
@bill93 If you don't dig it up, you're not really accepting it.?ÿ I gather he is accepting a mag indication in the tree that are not always accurate, but maybe for his purpose given the relationship to the other monuments in his survey it is the best evidence of the corner.?ÿ
I personally would look under the root ball like Nate suggested.?ÿ I found a similar size tree over an iron monument set over a 100 years ago.?ÿ It happened to be in the top of bank of a fill slope of an old graded road.?ÿ Dug down 2.5 feet from the side of the base and was able to find it and tie it in.?ÿ There was quite a bit of conflicting evidence from subsequent surveys that did not find the original monument, so it was a life saver for my survey.?ÿ?ÿ
You can only rely on the monument if you can prove that the location has not been disturbed.
It is difficult to prove undisturbed.
I thought the rule was to accept it unless you had strong evidence it was disturbed.
I don't see it as a foregone conclusion that the tree disturbed it, unless you can see the rebar/pipe is leaning because of pressure from the root.
I agree with Bill here, but the preponderance of evidence would be enough to hold or reject. Then you need to explain on your survey. Math is part of the evidence, as is everything else you observe.
Last month while Ridge Line was in the neighborhood, I showed him a center corner accepted by a DOT surveyor.?ÿ It was a 6" diameter pipe corner post with pipe bracing going to a similar pipe brace post several feet to the south.?ÿ The pipe had been filled with concrete by the farmer.?ÿ The DOT surveyor had affixed an aluminum cap with stenciling atop that bit of exposed concrete.?ÿ This was a good six feet above ground level.?ÿ Some here, who shall remain nameless (Radar, shhhhhh), would need a step ladder to find the cap.?ÿ Someday, for some reason, that post will lean from the nearly perfect vertical status found today.?ÿ Some short (ahem, vertically-challenged) surveyor will come along and either not find the cap or will set a monument at a different location matching his/her matemagical solution of where the TRUE CORNER is located.?ÿ Sad, but true.