The boundary surveying text by Curtis Brown is what I used to study for the PLS exam back in 1979.?ÿ That edition was a wonderful book.?ÿ Concise, to the point, accurate and great.?ÿ I still have it.?ÿ But later, I noticed that other editors kept adding their name to it, and it has become complex, voluminous and full of wasteful overwriting. And I saw this morning that one of the people offering FS PS training is now listed on the latest edition as an author. I wonder how much each of these supplemental authors actually wrote, or whether some of the additions are not making Brown's original book less useful.?ÿ Just my opinion/question.
Out of curiosity, I looked at some of the new FS PS example problems, and one of them seems to extract data regarding the natural hierarchy (hierarchy of calls) and mix apples and oranges asking for prioritization of things--Rights of possession, senior rights, natural monuments, distances.?ÿ ?ÿThose are different things.?ÿ Natural monuments and distances are part of the natural hierarchy, but rights are not.?ÿ If you look in a book that has too many pages and is too complex, you will find that list, but is not this a case of authors just adding stuff??ÿ This makes the whole thing too complex, and NCEES just pulling stuff out of it?
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We surveyors know what senior and junior rights are.?ÿ We know what possession is, but do all PLSs know what is mean by rights of possession??ÿ Of course we know that if someone possesses land that person can gain ownership of the land per civil code in any state, but to me, rights of possession is a vague term apparently pulled out of some additional stuff that a tack-on author decided to write just to be writing.
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I imagine that many will disagree, and I can understand that.?ÿ But I guess what I think is important is knowing what is important and the prevention of a bunch of sifting through worthless writing to memorize lists.?ÿ Basic Curtis Brown is great.?ÿ To much "writing" added to it by others is shame.?ÿ Beauty is in brevity and focus on what is important.?ÿ The rest contains too much waste.
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My opinion only.?ÿ
I think the trend of text books being updated for no reason beyond justifying another edition is fairly well established.?ÿ
The practice of bringing something new only as a profit vector and not because of an actual improvement is really fascinating and unfortunate. Sometimes I think our landfills are stocked with update after update until we circle back around to the solution established generations back.
I like the old school books better, and I hate it when reading a book and it is clear they are just arguing with another academic.?ÿ
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Brown has been edited for a number of reasons.
The laws we consider as retracing surveyor are not static, and our understanding of our duty to the public is continually evolving.
One very important reason relates to your comment regarding civil law. Rights of possession are generally earned by meeting a fact pattern laid out in Statute and supported by case law. The right is transferred when the conditions are met. Surveyors who ignore that do so at the peril of the community of owners, not to mention themselves. Wether this is spelled out in recent editions of Browns I cannot say. I"ve moved on to more substantive learning and keep Browns as a reference (thanks Dave L).
All that being said I have been dubbed a bibliophile (among other things) by many close to me. Reading and understanding surveying texts from the 1800's through the 'great awaking' of our profession in about 1977/78. None of those texts are perfect, but it helps understand the footsteps of the time. I would encourage any Surveyor to remember that last sentence well. If you insist on reading with too critical an eye you'll run out of books on day two or so. With all authors, build your knowledge from diverse sources. Hold on to the good, but recognize the faults and let them go.
My .02, Tom
I have often suggested on these pages that students of survey skip on buying the latest (expensive) editions of BC&LP and EPfBL and go for (used & very cheap) early editions.?ÿ
Yes, it has become something different than it started out to be, IMO.
The point I was trying to make is that as the new editions come out with new pile-on authors buying their way into being an author of already-established excellent texts, that the input from the pile-on authors seems to simply mess the book up with too much information.....and subsequently the NCEES and other examination groups pick stuff out of the bulky new books and treat it as the gospel for formulating a test question, which only one question could affect the career or kill the spirit of a good person wanting to become a professional surveyor.?ÿ?ÿ
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The comment about staying up with the latest greatest is well taken, but latest is not always greatest.?ÿ Sometimes it is pathetic and harmful.
Rights of possession should not be in the hierarchy of calls. The conditions for such is for a court to determine. A survey should show them and their relationship to the title lines but it should never factor into a surveyors decision unless a court has previously said so.
Never factor into a surveyor's decision? Are you suggesting?ÿ we ignore it?
The old editions over simplified things and left a lot out, but I haven't looked at any edition in many years, so I don't know if the extra words helped or hurt.?ÿ
The old editions over simplified things and left a lot out, but I haven't looked at any edition in many years, so I don't know if the extra words helped or hurt.?ÿ
I consider Wattles and Brown definitive?ÿ and have adhered to their judgements for a fifty year career without repercussions.?ÿ Although I've several Madson's books that promulgate occupation, not monumentation holds.?ÿ It seems our job is to?ÿ determine the record, and if occupation is wildly inaccurate offer a survey resolution amenable to both parties since they've been in repose for 50 years.?ÿ If not then on to the court where we meekly provide records?ÿ of found monuments and the court deicides.?ÿ Liability is low.
2500' long stone wall that is within 4' of the straight line the deed calls for.?ÿ When subdivided I'm not going to be the surveyor who sets the new lot corner 4 feet off that 100 yr. old plus stone wall.?ÿ That was pretty good work for a few hundred years ago.?ÿ Deeds lines don't?ÿ leave footsteps!
Being listed as an author gives credence to their right to charge a higher fee for their educational guidance. Sometimes things are changed not because the facts or law have changed but simply by the fact that a change, even unnecessary, gives a copyright opportunity.
Paul in PA
Unfortunately, that is a more common occurrence than one might think
And at the same time PLS candidates are studying the voluminous writings of the these pile-on authors are used as enough authority to formulate a question from one of their paragraphs. The new FS practice exam has one of these questions on it.?ÿ
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Previous NCEES PS sample exam had one question where a surveyor drove to a job about 100 miles away and forgot his level and was staking out a construction project, and the construction company was in the urgent mode.?ÿ The question asked what he should do...by my recollection the possible answers were
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1.?ÿ Go back and get the level
2.?ÿ Have someone from office bring level and meet you half way.
3.?ÿ Have someone bring the level the site
4.?ÿ Adjust the out-of-adjustment level owned by the contractor and use it.?ÿ It also gave the technique as I recall, which used some buzz words.
The correct answer was No. 4.?ÿ?ÿ
While No. 4 is the answer NCEES wanted, there is no way in hell that I would use a used level that was out of adjustment and try to adjust it myself and stake out a job that could have millions in liability, and with a edgy and rushed contractor out there pushing me.?ÿ Plus, even if I did adjust it, the person driving the level to me would have arrived by the time I completed it.?ÿ Why should an aspiring surveyor candidate have to endure this--combined with the junk that is being added to some of the textbooks (as opposed to good and useful textbook improvements).?ÿ I can see it in court.
Cross examination questions:
1.?ÿ Are you an instrument repairman?
2.?ÿ Have you ever done a full adjustment of a level?
3.?ÿ Are you competent to produce a certificate of adjustment that would be acceptable say for USGS?
4.?ÿ Did the instrument have any other problems??ÿ Are you POSITIVE?
5.?ÿ I understand that you tried to equalize backsights and foresights, but would a loose ocular affect it?
6.?ÿ Why did you let the contractor rush you??ÿ Why didn't you retrieve your level?
7.?ÿ If you had it to do all over again, would you have retrieved your calibrated and adjusted level?
8.?ÿ What caused the 0.06-ft bust that caused my client to tear down the walls of this nuclear reactor?
9.?ÿ What is the value of your home?
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The way you figure out that test problem has nothing to do with reality.?ÿ
All the answers having to do with getting your own level take the same amount of time and thus can be considered equivalent.?ÿ Therefore the test writer wants you to choose the unique answer that must be assumed to be faster.
... PLS candidates are studying the voluminous writings of the these pile-on authors ...
Brown's books are, or were initially intended to be, an introduction to the principles of boundary location law. Hence their titles. They were not intended to be comprehensive academic treatises on all the nuances of boundary law. There is a book, also edited by Mr. Robillard, titled Clark on Surveying and Boundaries that fills?ÿ that niche.?ÿ ?ÿ
The licensed surveyors that volunteer to help NCEES develop questions have a full library of surveying texts, including multiple editions, in which to use as a reference for any given question.?ÿ And typically more than one of those licensed surveyors has to validate the entire question, including the reference, before a question is released to be used on an exam.
The sample questions are no longer used in an active exam and published by NCEES as a guide for examinees to use in understanding the exam experience so they are adequately prepared for the test.?ÿ Those questions are not intended to "teach" the examinees "how to survey"?ÿ or replace the education/experience necessary to actually practice in the real world.?ÿ That is our job!?ÿ The exam is intended to measure whether the examinee has the minimum amount of competency to practice.
This being said, I tend to agree with the other premise posted by Frank in that many of the most recent revisions have not added much benefit beyond that which bionicman suggested pertaining to updates on statutes/case law decision since the earlier versions were written.?ÿ Good or bad, purporting to be an expert author and speaker is in some ways, just another niche market for very few members of any professional community.
@party-chef?ÿ The trend is not recent. I visited a friend at Austin-Peay and picked up a copy of a Differential equations text. When I took the course a year later, at another college, the text book was the next edition of the same book. Literally, the only thing that had changed was the problems. Textbooks are a racket.
I consider keeping clients out of court to be a part of my job.?ÿ
