??I was setting line stakes on a simple lot job this morning and a previous owner of my client's property had built a very nice fence a couple inches inside his line all the way around.?
I am making an assumption your client is landscaping within the fence, not the ??couple inches? adjacent the adjoiner you mention. Continuing along that assumption,?ÿ
??Found all but one corner and set thin wooden lathe marked "PROPERTY LINE" all around the perimeter.?ÿ A neighbor lady came out and asked/told me in no uncertain terms, "You'll remove that right".?
Why didn??t you just set an IR and then remove the lath instead of explaining something to someone who doesn??t have a clue? A lot less hassle. ?????ÿ
I was setting line stakes on a simple lot job this morning and a previous owner of my client's property had built a very nice fence a couple inches inside his line all the way around.?ÿ My client is now doing some extensive landscaping and wanted to make sure he knew where the lines were and hired me to mark the lines.?ÿ Found all but one corner and set thin wooden lathe marked "PROPERTY LINE" all around the perimeter.?ÿ A neighbor lady came out and asked/told me in no uncertain terms, "You'll remove that right".?ÿ I explained to her that I was marking the property lines of her neighbor and those stakes were the property line markers.?ÿ So she says after no consideration, "yes but you'll remove those right".?ÿ Another long explanation that the property line, hers included run right through the center of the stake, the property on the other side is not hers, the fence is built per usual, inside the line by a couple inches and that I've been hired to mark the lines to make sure the new landscaping is not encroaching.?ÿ Guess what response I get.?ÿ "But you'll remove those right"?ÿ Another lengthy explanation about ........... and on and on.?ÿ At least five times verbatim.?ÿ No variation, no understanding, and no common consensus reached.?ÿ I can usually get the very arcane idea if surveying across to folks but it was in direct conflict with her initial reaction and there was not going to be anything besides a satisfied smirk once I "removed that".?ÿ She didn't get her smirk and I didn't get anything across as many different ways as I tried to approach it.?ÿ You can't please all of the people all of the time.
You must be new to rhetorical questions.?ÿ ????ÿ
What is "RCW 16.60.055"?
Revised Code of Washington , Washington State Statute.
And this instructs landowners as to who pays for fences?
When staking a line for one of the owners, I offset the stakes on to the side of the Owner I??m working for by at least a foot or more depending on how much room is available. ?ÿAt the top of the lath, the offset distance is labeled with a circle around it. ?ÿThe adjacent owner has no right to remove the stakes since it is not on their property. Make sure to follow up with an exhibit of what was staked and note the offset.
I really like this idea. The stakes can also stay in place during fence construction as well.
@shea-gleadle Just be sure to explain the stakes to thd fence guy. We had a bank of lots with 2 foot offset stakes end up with a two foot offset fence. Not all fenxe builders are trained up like the other trades...
Of coarse. I usually paint up anything I offset as well for ease of understanding and visualization purposes.
RCW?ÿ16.60.055
Fence on the land of another by mistake??Removal.
And this instructs landowners as to who pays for fences?
I was answering your question about what RCW 16.60.060 was.?ÿ Probably RCW 16.60.020 addresses the question of cost apportionment more directly.
Lived in an HOA community in NY, the bylaws stated that fences shall be a minimum 6? from the property line. Hence, like Mr Cow said, there??d be one foot wide strip full of weeds that neither owner would take care of. Don??t know if others ever complained to the HOA about it.
@thebionicman If you put it on the boundary you'd be encroaching on the neighbor, eh??ÿ I see that a lot with the old Hawaiian dry stack rock walls here where they set the original boundaries zigging and zagging along and down the middle of them.?ÿ Makes it so neither neighbor can touch them without consensus.
And this instructs landowners as to who pays for fences?
I was answering your question about what RCW 16.60.060 was.?ÿ Probably RCW 16.60.020 addresses the question of cost apportionment more directly.
Thanks Mark - I just read it. That is one of the most foolish things I've ever seen!
@dave-o Fences intended to act as enclosures are placed on the line. By necessity that puts part of the fence on each property and sets up cost-sharing for maintenance. An encroachment is there without authority so no, it isn't an encroachment.
It's best to understand fence law in your state if you're a surveyor:
The chart below provides a summary of state laws related to fence laws in Wyoming, including links to important code sections.
|
Statutes |
|
|
Construction and Maintenance of Partition Fences ?ÿ |
The owner of any lawful fence that is/becomes a partition fence may require the other person to pay for one-half of the actual cost or what it would cost to construct the fence. In case the other person refuses, the owner may initiate a civil action against them. |
|
Lawful Fences |
Lawful fences are those that are made well enough to keep livestock out. Typical example: Three-line barbed wire fence. Pole or board fences are also acceptable. |
|
Neglect to Close Fences; Penalty |
It is a misdemeanor to leave the gate on a lawful fence open, even if it is accidental. |
The last one is an important one to consider out in the field. I take pictures in controversial situations.?ÿ
Cost sharing of partition fences is established in Kansas law, as well.?ÿ If the adjoiner refuses to pay, the one wishing to have a proper fence constructed can approach the County Commission to have them serve as the legal fence viewers.?ÿ The Commission then schedules a date on which they will meet at the needed fence location and traverse to the far end of the fence to note the reasoning for a new or improved fence and what must be done.?ÿ They then take a vote as to the plan of action or to deny the applicant's request as the existing fence has been deemed adequate to meet the official definition of a legal fence.
The typical scenario is a case where the old fencing has been allowed to deteriorate to such condition that livestock can easily cross the boundary.?ÿ To put the the new fence on the boundary may require the removal of trees, brush and the old fencing before construction of the new fence can be placed on the boundary line.?ÿ The cost of constructing a legal fence is then placed half on the applicant and half on the adjoiner.?ÿ If the adjoiner refuses to pay half of the expense, that cost will be added to his real estate tax for that year.?ÿ Please note that I said a "legal fence".?ÿ There is a State Statute clearly stating how that is defined.?ÿ Posts must be no farther apart than a certain distance and there must be at least three wires with specified measurements between them.?ÿ The applicant must pay full share for additional wires and additional posts, but, typically the adjoiner will pay half of the full expense.
In one case I was called in to set line stakes along the true boundary so the fence would be placed correctly.?ÿ A different surveyor had surveyed the adjoiner's tract several years earlier and I agreed fully with his procedure and monuments.?ÿ In that case the adjoiner was an out-of-state owner who used his land primarily for hunting purposes and wanted no trees or brush removed.?ÿ But, he did have some cropland on his tract that could be injured by the lack of a legal fence.?ÿ ?ÿHe paid his share grudgingly.
It is a misdemeanor to leave the gate on a lawful fence open, even if it is accidental.
I'm religious about that,?ÿ but it begs the question;?ÿ what if you encounter a gate that is open??ÿ I've asked dozens of ranchers about that and if in the boonies leave the gate as you found it seems to be the consensus, as the cattle may need it for access to water, etc.?ÿ In areas with a lot of foreign traffic they'll post a "Please Close Gate" sign if that's what they want, or if having problems resort to locks ???.
@wagner152?ÿ ?ÿExactly what I was about to suggest.?ÿ ?ÿ if you stake it "ON" the line, the neighbor could make a claim to remove the stakes on the shared line.?ÿ ?ÿ
