I guess that a pointed edge would help in setting a rod in rocky or shale type soils, but we don't have any trouble driving blunt end rods down into the ground. Around here, there are almost no rocks to be found at all - if a mad dog or something gets after you, you better be able to out run it to the nearest brick if you want to chunk something at it. Either that or carry the rocks with you. However, I do know from experience that a blunt ended rod can be driven through tree roots, gas lines, a 900 pair telephone cable, a water line or a hornet's nest.
However, I do know from experience that a blunt ended rod can be driven through tree roots, gas lines, a 900 pair telephone cable
That's a man that speaks from long days in the field!
The pointy ones will do the same, although, maybe they slip alongside something once in a while.
No rocks, no shale, no frozen ground; sounds like monument setting heaven.
I like it, especially if it is in the right spot. Bushhogs and bulldozers are liable to miss that one for some time. The landowners should be able to recognize that corner easily once you put two rolls of flagging on the tree along with some paint.
As to the pin moving as the tree grows, I have to think the position is actually more stable than most pins set in soil. Haven't you come across things grown into trees over the years. In twenty years, the pin should be well under the current cambium layer and some surveyor is going to dig it out and post a picture on the future Beerleg forum, tickled to have found an original monument.
"You need to thoroughly blaze the side of the tree closest to the monument and the nearby roots."
That is funny as hell! Paint the whole tree fluorescent pink and orange too - so its visible from hundreds of feet away...
> Don't stray off course now. I'd be willing to bet that neither your local subdivision ordinance, the plat certification(?), or any other statute or law requires (or even allows) you to reject an original corner because is doesn't meet some arbitrary measurement error ratio.
Wasn't planning on discounting or discarding the monument, just calling into question the accuracy of the location, and the additional uncertainty created. The lot is adjacent to two metes and bounds tracts that don't call for the monument, so if the monument does move (and if it was set with greater relative positional accuracy than 0.2 feet, then it has moved) then the lotline moves along with it, creating gaps and/or overlaps. Granted, they are small gaps and/or overlaps at this point, and basically moot. What will they be in 50 years? 100? Maybe also negligible at that point, but still an additional source of uncertainty, IMO.
> You found the location. What is there to calculate???
Is the monument in its original position? I can calculate the differences in relative position of the found subdivision monuments, the magnitude of variation from platted dimensions, and their position relative to the Public Land System, and the magnitude of the record gaps and/or overlaps with the adjacent metes-and-bounds tracts.
> Part two of mission. Perpetuate the original evidence. Place a few reference monuments to memorialize the location just in case the tree "moves", falls down, is hit by lightning, or falls victim to some other natural or man-caused disturbance. Record what you have found and done to preserve the location.
Excellent idea. I think that perhaps the original surveyor could have done the same thing and noted the tree at the corner. I have in essence treated the other subdivision monuments as "witnesses" to the original location of the monument, although at a much greater distance away than a traditional witness would be located.
> As to the practice of sticking a rebar in the crotch of a tree for a property corner? If this is the worst offense to the surveying profession you can find, dance a jig and rejoice is your good fortune. Trust me, there are a boat load of other despicable practices that we need to weed out before worrying about an original corner being set in a tree.
I agree completely. I was interested in hearing other surveyors' opinions on the topic, as well as a defense of setting points in trees. Mission accomplished. There is some good stuff in this thread, including and especially your input. Much appreciated.
Nothing but love intended.
~J
Luke the lumberjack is in for a big surprise someday.
Is this any different than driving a rail road spike into a tree trunk to use as a bench mark?
I can not bring myself to do that and the local bunny huggers have a fit if you do anyway...
Near here, at the end of a spiral curve to Hwy 77, the R/W monument is in an elm tree. Approximately 5/8 of the top surface is exposed. Just enough to locate the center.
I am glad it is there because locating the R/W would be very hard because there are no other monuments left in that area.
I never hesitate to set a nail or rebar in a tree root, stump or side if possible.
If unable I set tpost reference along the boundaries leaving the monument at 10 to 20 feet away and make reference in my description and drawing.
B-)
Brings up one of the newbie tricks played on me back in 1977...Told to search for RR spike benchmark set in a tree...and told the tree had grown about 12 feet taller since it was set...I was told to look about 12 up the tree...
sigh
DDSM:'(
I figured it out real quick...thinking I would be walking under bobwire fences...;-)
"bobwire"??????
Must be an Arkansas thingy.
> I never hesitate to set a nail or rebar in a tree root, stump or side if possible.
> B-)
Sounds like an East Texas thang...huh?
It might be of interest that back during my mark setting days with the U.S. Coast Survey leveling days we set copper nails and washers in the roots of trees for TBM's.
So I would say if the pin was set the tree will grow around it since verticaly the elevation would hold on the nails and washers
Quit arguing about the monument and SET UP ON IT!
😉
I agree with a couple of the guys here; the tree will simply grow around it. The outer layer is all that will grow.
Is your two-tenth error because of where you located it? It is sticking up quite a bit so I assume it is leaning. Did you locate both the top and where it enters the tree? Or, it could be in the trunk. Offsetting it would have been a better option.
