I'm running a 2" Geomax Zoom90 (basically a Lecia TS15/TS13) and of course the dealer says it should be sent back for calibration/service once a year. I've worked for places that do just that and places that only send the gun into the dealer if it gets dropped.
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I'm the only user who baby's it and lucky if it get a full day of work a week. My question is do they really need to go back each year??ÿ Particularly interested in other Lecia/Geomax users experience.
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Also for Lecia/Geomax users how often do you go though the check and adjust routine??ÿ Also where do you find something tall enough to point at for vertical angle?
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I've always put it off thinking the dealer calibration ought to be the best and if my pointing is not perfect with the check and adjust routine then I could put it out more? Typical my left/right face horizontal angles are within a couple seconds but the vertical split is often ~8" which always seems to have been that way.
I'm not sure about your specific gun but the adjustment routine for Trimble guns works well and I've never seen a dealers adjustment do anything different. Some clients or projects might require a certificate of calibration within the past twelve months otherwise you should be fine doing it yourself.
Servicing may be included in the CCP, in which case it??s worth having it done.
You should still calibrate it regardless of whether you get it serviced or not. Nothing better than having a TS that you know is right.?ÿ
I typically calibrate yearly, or if I think it needs it. Phone towers, power pylons, quarries, etc are good for the vertical.?ÿ
My Zoom80 is set to pester to check and adjust me every 6 months, as I recall.?ÿ I probably do it more like every year.?ÿ In the 7 years I've had the instrument the calibration values have changed very little (sub-second, as I recall) after each adjustment.
I typically do the adjustment while set up near a light tower.?ÿ The tilt axis sighting is a pain -- I'm usually near the limit of visual access through the scope by the time I find a well-defined target up that high.
The proof is in the splits of sets of angles. If they are tight you are good on collimation.
At my current work there is a TCRP1203 in service. Purchased in 2006. I do not think that it has ever been collimated or serviced in any way. When we recently replaced the dc with a new CS20 (in conjunction with a GPS purchase) the salesman took it back to the shop for a once over. The story goes that the service technician declined to open it up, saying that he was likely to be opening a can of worms. It's working, and it yields good splits, why mess with it??ÿ
I wouldn't criticize one who took his instrument in for regular service but I've hardly ever seen it done.?ÿ I can't say I've ever seen any negative thing happen because of that.?ÿ ?ÿ ?ÿ
Now, continuing to use an instrument that is not functioning properly, that is quite another matter.
I'm running a 2" Geomax Zoom90 (basically a Lecia TS15/TS13) and of course the dealer says it should be sent back for calibration/service once a year. I've worked for places that do just that and places that only send the gun into the dealer if it gets dropped.
?ÿ
I'm the only user who baby's it and lucky if it get a full day of work a week. My question is do they really need to go back each year??ÿ Particularly interested in other Lecia/Geomax users experience.
?ÿ
Also for Lecia/Geomax users how often do you go though the check and adjust routine??ÿ Also where do you find something tall enough to point at for vertical angle?
?ÿ
I've always put it off thinking the dealer calibration ought to be the best and if my pointing is not perfect with the check and adjust routine then I could put it out more? Typical my left/right face horizontal angles are within a couple seconds but the vertical split is often ~8" which always seems to have been that way.
My experience with the Leica 1203+ is that it is 12 years old and never been back to the dealer....I've done the field collimation adjustment 3 times now (it reminds you every 6 months) but the changes are always 0-3" in every adjustment... doesn't seem to go out of calibration for a long time.?ÿ
The new s5 needs a second calibration and it's a few months old but I've only used it half of that time at most (keep going back to the Leica because I really hate the Trimble and have had constant software issues since getting it, both with the tsc5 and tsc7). It went out of calibration a couple weeks after first using it and again the other day I noticed an abnormally large split between faces again. Went back to the Leica until I get a chance to calibrate it. I know it only takes about 10 minutes to do it, but the Leica saves me probably an hour a day in normal usage, so it was a good excuse to go back to it.
The sokkia ix I had before the Leica would go out of calibration about every 6 months.?ÿ
@lurker?ÿ
It is noticeably easier to calibrate the Trimble vs the Leica (it was only my first time and it was one of the painless things about my Trimble experience so far). Good thing since it needs it so frequently.?ÿ
@350rocketmike
Assuming you gentlemen are doing left face and right face observations regularly do you typically see much difference between faces and if so do the horizontal/vertical differences vary in magnitude? My current practice is to do left/right face on the first backsight of the day to make sure all ok then left face from then on.
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My horizontal splits are usually spot on or a couple of seconds but vertical typically is 6-8" which isn't heaps for the limited about of height work I do but seems an oddity to me that they are different.
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Boy this site is great for finding out user info that you don't get straight answers on from the dealers always. Typically a gun service here is 1.2k and all I think they do is put it over their "digital baseline" tester and check the lube on them.
I use a Topcon PS103A, which should be a 3" pointing error. That means 6" splits, or better. It will do that immediately after collimation. Next day, not so much. Maybe 8" -12" for sight lengths of 200-300 feet. This is the second PS103A which I've been saddled with and the experience has been the same with both of them.?ÿ So I'm sighting FL/FR a lot of the time.
The glass being used makes a difference. Splits to my Leica GMP101 mini prisms are better than splits to any off-brand glass. A Leica GRZ4 360?ø prism splits better than the Topcon?ÿ ATP2 360?ø that came with the instrument. Leica glass is better.
Should add then that thanks to Jim Frames posts some years back I'm a GMP 101 convert, have two and one is always on the pole and the other on legs for backsight, much nicer than lugging the 360 around, I don't do wide open space topo with robot ever though.?ÿ Never use the grz4 (Geomax zmp1) on the pole just for the odd backsight where need to see same point from multiple setups.
The proof is in the splits of sets of angles. If they are tight you are good on collimation.
At my current work there is a TCRP1203 in service. Purchased in 2006. I do not think that it has ever been collimated or serviced in any way. When we recently replaced the dc with a new CS20 (in conjunction with a GPS purchase) the salesman took it back to the shop for a once over. The story goes that the service technician declined to open it up, saying that he was likely to be opening a can of worms. It's working, and it yields good splits, why mess with it??ÿ
I wouldn't criticize one who took his instrument in for regular service but I've hardly ever seen it done.?ÿ I can't say I've ever seen any negative thing happen because of that.?ÿ ?ÿ ?ÿ
Now, continuing to use an instrument that is not functioning properly, that is quite another matter.
I was advised similarly with my 1203. Don??t get it serviced as they don??t carry parts or CCP for it any more. Just enjoy using it.?ÿ
I was taught for tight verticals a collimation check is required after 15?ø change in ambient temperature. This may require a check a couples tines a day.
@lukenz?ÿ
Collimation routine in Topcon must differ from your equipment. As we only need to site an object near 90?ø from zenith,?ÿ then flip the scope and remeaure the same target. Doesn't need to be a prism, no distance is measured.?ÿ
On a Leica collimation doesn't require high-angle sighting. Just the tilting axis.
In my experience (Leica mostly), it's not so much due to ambient change in temperature, as it is differential heating, where some parts of the instrument are warmer than the other. You'll often see a variance if one side of the instrument is exposed to direct sunlight.?ÿ
@lukenz?ÿ
I do regularly shoot 2 faces and I get similarl results to yours. Vertical is always worse but typically 10-12" at the most (using a grz4 360 prism).?ÿ
The Trimble using the mt1000 active prism in semi active mode was close to the same or slightly worse, until it started to get worse and then I got 30" between faces the other day so I decided to use the Leica again for a few days and run the calibration on the s5 this weekend.?ÿ
The sokkia ix always had worse splits horizontal and especially vertical even after being serviced and then collimation adjustments done.?ÿ
With Lecia check and adjust process, the standard process is shoot the prism at near horizontal on both faces a couple of times and then have to sight angle only to a target +/- 27 degrees off horizontal. See https://blog.hexagongeosystems.com/quick-and-simple-user-calibration-of-your-leica-total-station/
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Not sure what you are doing if not doing the vertical angle one also?
There's a couple of options for calibrations on most Leicas.?ÿ
The combined adjustment covers l, t, i, c and ATR and uses just a horizontal target.
The tilting axis adjustment covers a and uses a high-angle target.
https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1485224/Leica-Ts13.html?page=51#manual
Field calibration is actually quite simple on Leica instruments taking no more than 15 minutes once it is acclimatized.?ÿ I have MS50 to bug me monthly, but I also make it a habit of running the routine if the instrument has been shipped or I'm working on a project with tight tolerances.?ÿ I first run through the L, T, I, C, ATR correction using a GPH1 (it is easier to sight).?ÿ I then run the tilting axis check ('a').?ÿ You do not need to have a prism or high target for this routine.?ÿ The requirement is at least 27 degrees of tilt either way from horizontal, I just make sure to set the instrument up low enough that a I can the ground through the scope.?ÿ I usually target several specs in concrete.?ÿ I run at least 3 measurement groups for each routine.?ÿ
The Leica 1203+ is still harassing me because I did all the adjustments except tilting axis because I'm never set up anywhere it can be done. I have to specifically search out something I can sight.?ÿ
The Trimble routine definitely takes less time because of this not being part of it, but maybe doesn't accomplish as much.?ÿ
Seems like Trimble s series in general don't value accuracy as much as Leica, since they build a robot that's basically useless without the active prism which is inherently less accurate to begin with.?ÿ