From: K (The Realtor)
- Good morning the your company did a survey 1/28/2016 for D**** B******* on 1413 M***** C***** Road the property is being sold and we were wondering what it would take to have that survey recertified to the new buyer. There have been no improvements to the property since that day and no land transfers on surrounding properties, thank you!!
Me:
- I don't find D**** B******* on my computer. Do you have anything else? A description, or a shot of the previous plat?
K (The Realtor) Sends me a barely legible copy.
Me:
- OK, I found the drawing... It was done by my dad and his crew. The plat was hand drawn, and typed with a manual typewriter.
What you are asking me to do, is to: Trust you and your client, and client's neighbors that "All things are the same". That no pins have been moved, or destroyed. That the Utility companies, and water companies, who like to dig up along the sides of roads, have not removed, and replaced pins, in a haphazard manner. (Like you, and your client, and their neighbors are my field crew, and that without any training, or supervision, have performed this duty, to the satisfaction of Arkansas Min Stds for surveys). And, to accept the liability that comes with it. This will be alot more expensive, than a normal update to the survey.
So, Re-certify, the survey, without field work, (to expedite the time) will be around $ 12,000.00. I don't have a very clear copy of it at this time. So, I will have to regenerate this in AutoCad. I would also, AFTER THE FACT, be planning to come back, and perform the necessary field work, to be sure that what was sent out the door, was correct. It's just a matter of timing.
Do you get a commission for being a real estate agent? Yes. If you sold a given parcel of real estate 5 years ago, and you were re selling the same parcel, would you do it for a drastically reduced commission? No, I don't think so. And, I gently suggest it is an insult to ask me to do this. Really, I'm not offended, but I am aware that many surveyors are generally poor business persons. And, that this "recertify to new client, with new date" has been a common practice, in the past. However, it is not very tenable, in our modern society, where to own and invest in cutting edge surveying equipment, can mean way upwards of $ 100,000 in expense, to learn, and become a licensed surveyor, then set up shop, to provide professional services.
So, to perform a normal update, of a survey that is 5 yrs old, will be $ 3,250.00. And, I can have it done in about 2-3 weeks. This means field work is performed BEFORE the plat is released. This is my prefered way to operate. And, I gently suggest that this is a bargain.
This will include walking the perimeter, with GPS survey equipment, and verifying all the corners, and line marks.
And, a nice clear drawing.Please let me know.
Thank you,
Nate
------------------------------------------------------
OK, this is the communication so far. Could any of you provide me with any suggestions, and advice?
This seems to be an area of "Traditional Self Abuse" that surveyors have learned to accommodate. I really think we all need to re-think the business side of surveying, in many areas.?ÿ
Thanks for listening.
Nate
?ÿ
Lawyer for the buyer "Larry, that's a steep price for an update of a survey you did 2 years ago. You know, you we can close this with a owner's affidavit.?ÿ
Me "Would that show the pool that was added last year. From the road it looks pretty close to the property line?"
That's about as much as I can get into it without getting myself in trouble or upsetting myself and ruining the day.?ÿ?ÿ
From: K (The Realtor)
- Good morning the your company did a survey 1/28/2016 for D*?ÿB*?ÿon 1413 M** C**?ÿRoad the property is being sold and we were wondering what it would take to have that survey recertified to the new buyer. There have been no improvements to the property since that day and no land transfers on surrounding properties, thank you!!
Me:
- NO
?ÿ
Q.E.D.
OK so they insinuate that it should be easier and cost less this time. I ignore their insinuations and provide them with an estimated cost and time frame. I don't get angry, I revert to my survey ZEN and give them a professional reply and am not bothered if they decline my services.
If you must have them as a client then it is not so easy. However if your need for them is not so great, then allow yourself to establish the terms that you want in order to provide them a service. You are in control, don't let the potential client try to take that away from you.
The power of NO.
Just tell them GPS.
?ÿ
GO POUND SAND!
?ÿ
There is no such thing a re-certification in my neck of the woods, same with mortgage surveys.?ÿ I can count on one hand the number of times I have surveyed the same parcel for different clients. It's a full price survey each time or they can use someone else.?ÿ
If nothing has changed then why don't they use the 2016 survey?
If you understand what "recertify" means (I don't) why is everyone so upset? Just tell them what it will take or that you are to busy to bother. They may not be happy with what it takes, but you may be surprised. I wouldn't assume they expect a ridiculously low cost (I would not be at all surprised though...)
Wait till the angry reply to your estimate to get angry yourself. They havn't done anything wrong...yet.?ÿ
??The title company/realtor said it would be quick and easy...?
?Your beef is with them then, not me. I??m not telling you how much a title policy costs or a commission should be, why are you listening to them on how much a survey should cost??
New here???? Hi
Sounds like they are asking what it would take and sounds like you nailed a bid with 3200. Sounds like a full day possibly a little more of field work to see if anything is missing .?ÿ And two full days research and recreate the map in the office. At 1000$ or so a day I think you nailed it. If it were me i would them know if they want missing pins reset and not just lathe the price could go up.
You provide a service! Thay can accept the bid or not???
Simply send a message back that states your standard fees and the possible date of getting started on the field work, barring inclement weather conditions.?ÿ That's the bottom line.?ÿ They either use you or they don't.?ÿ You can't lose money on a job you don't do.
Could any of you provide me with any suggestions, and advice?
Yea Natester, abandon the project it's hopeless. ?????ÿ
Unfortunately, there is most likely someone out there that will do the work for next to nothing. You can??t worry yourself with them. They are the ones losing money. Just give them your quote and see what happens. Like HC says, you can??t lose money or your license on a job you didn??t do.?ÿ
K the realtor replied:
Nate, thank you for your reply.?ÿ ?ÿFirst of all I was unaware you were not the person who performed the original survey on the property, your email was given to me by F******** Surveying since the phone# online was not in service.?ÿ I would not have asked a different surveyor to recertify work he didn't do. I will contact the parties and see what direction they want to take.?ÿ Thank you.
________________________________
I think K the realtor does not really want to give up on "recertify with new date".?ÿ
I'm glad she's enough "business" to reply. Even though she's using the wrong mental setup.
But, I can't totally blame them. We have trained them to do this. We are poor business people. Maybe I could become a realtor.... 🙂
Thanks everyone.
I'll post if I do the job.
Nate
I would not have asked a different surveyor to recertify work he didn't do.
As if that makes the request any less obnoxious. ?????ÿ
The real estate profession has a built-in problem.?ÿ It's all based on commission.?ÿ You can spend a hundred hours of your valuable time and not make a penny.?ÿ Other times you spend one hour of your time and make $2,000.?ÿ Ya gotta kiss a lotta frogs to find a prince.
I'm on both sides of this.?ÿ
No, you shouldn't just recertify an old survey without going through a certain amount of due diligence. That would include a renewed records research and a site visit to confirm that conditions are unchanged. There should be charges for that, and charges for the renewed liability.
But for a survey of a site you did in 2016 (or 1996) you should have stable, recoverable, and coordinated control points in the ground, the raw field data, and editable drawing files readily available. You shouldn't have to redo all that work. There should be something built into your fee for retaining these things, which does have a cost. I appreciate the part about being your Dad's work product and that he doesn't do CAD. But the client really shouldn't be criticized for having expectations in line with common modern practice.?ÿ
Selling your work a second and third time is an opportunity to make real money.?ÿ
?ÿ
?ÿ
you should have stable, recoverable, and coordinated control points in the ground, the raw field data, and editable drawing files readily available. You shouldn't have to redo all that work. There should be something built into your fee for retaining these things, which does have a cost.
Dad did job with field book, and total station.
Semi geodetic brngs. Via blm Resurvey. 40 plus acres....
?ÿ
