Scott Ellis, post: 440998, member: 7154 wrote: I can not understand ......
Just stop there. 😉
Scott Ellis, post: 441011, member: 7154 wrote: I keep hearing nothing is square in PLSS. Well why is it not square
Many regions look square from 10,000 feet in the air. Some look pretty close to square on a USGS topo map but you can often see the difference. Very few measure square to today's tolerances.
Why?
Because of convergence of the meridians and various methods of dealing with that.
Because the lines were run by deputy surveyors struggling to do it fast enough in sometimes rough country to make payroll for a crew and enough left over to live on.
Because a few of them weren't conscientious.
Because conscientious meant following the instructions using compass and chain and meeting a standard of just 1:320 in the era when some states were surveyed. That's a closure of 1 chain in going around a section.
Because compass declination (variation in the GLO notes) changes by several minutes depending on time of day and season even if there is no local attraction.
Bill93, post: 441037, member: 87 wrote: Many regions look square from 10,000 feet in the air. Some look pretty close to square on a USGS topo map but you can often see the difference. Very few measure square to today's tolerances.
Why?
Because of convergence of the meridians and various methods of dealing with that.Because the lines were run by deputy surveyors struggling to do it fast enough in sometimes rough country to make payroll for a crew and enough left over to live on.
Because a few of them weren't conscientious.
Because conscientious meant following the instructions using compass and chain and meeting a standard of just 1:320 in the era when some states were surveyed. That's a closure of 1 chain in going around a section.
Because compass declination (variation in the GLO notes) changes by several minutes depending on time of day and season even if there is no local attraction.
The convergence of meridian is address in the manual and that error is adjusted for.
I have followed Surveys that were originally done with a compass and chain, and they were performed very well and using today's advanced measuring equipment will get you the same measurements to the corners as they did with the chain and compass. I sure hope it does not take a season to measure 1 mile.
Bill93, post: 441037, member: 87 wrote: Many regions look square from 10,000 feet in the air. Some look pretty close to square on a USGS topo map but you can often see the difference. Very few measure square to today's tolerances.
Why?
Because of convergence of the meridians and various methods of dealing with that.Because the lines were run by deputy surveyors struggling to do it fast enough in sometimes rough country to make payroll for a crew and enough left over to live on.
Because a few of them weren't conscientious.
Because conscientious meant following the instructions using compass and chain and meeting a standard of just 1:320 in the era when some states were surveyed. That's a closure of 1 chain in going around a section.
Because compass declination (variation in the GLO notes) changes by several minutes depending on time of day and season even if there is no local attraction.
Plus typical sections are controlled by 8 separate monumented corners that make it an eight sided figure.
At least that is what I was taught.
Robert Hill, post: 441043, member: 378 wrote: Plus typical sections are controlled by 8 separate monumented corners that make it an eight sided figure.
At least that is what I was taught.
So PLSS can not get 3 corners to line up on a single line?
Shades of FrancisH ...:unamused:
Warren Smith, post: 441045, member: 9900 wrote: Shades of FrancisH ...:unamused:
I'm pretty sure it is Francis!
Scott Ellis, post: 441044, member: 7154 wrote: So PLSS can not get 3 corners to line up on a single line?
I retraced a mile of line last year where tge flattest part was 25% slope and the steepest was near vertical. The line measured 12 feet 'long', with the quarter corner stone being about 2 feet off line and 8 feet from midpoint.
Considering it was run in 1867 (and not since) I'm gonna say they ran it straight.
Scott Ellis, post: 441044, member: 7154 wrote: So PLSS can not get 3 corners to line up on a single line?
Why are you being a troll Ahole?
Robert Hill, post: 441051, member: 378 wrote: Why are you being a troll Ahole?
Because like the PLSS system it's easy to troll PLSS Surveyors.
Peter Ehlert, post: 441003, member: 60 wrote: he is obviously pulling your chain. He does the debate thing well, he had me hooked, as did Kent
Yes.
His experience as a 20 year old riding around Baton Rouge recovering section corners is bogus.
He was probably riding along drinking Dr. Peppers and munching on chips with a Tx jack leg seismic or pipeline crew going through the pretense of establishing some boundary control of some kind. Real loosey goosey surveying. He never saw a section corner..that I can Garantee as Justin Wilson would say.
Robert Hill, post: 441054, member: 378 wrote: Yes.
His experience as a 20 year old riding around Baton Rouge recovering section corners is bogus.
He was probably riding along drinking Dr. Peppers and munching on chips with a Tx jack leg seismic or pipeline crew going through the pretense of establishing some boundary control of some kind. Real loosey goosey surveying. He never saw a section corner..that I can Garantee as Justin Wilson would say.
Actually that part is true, we did look for and found plenty of the section corners. I was also 18 not 20. My choice of drink has never been Dr. Pepper but a good deal of Texans love Dr. Pepper.
I have never worked for a lossey goosey surveying firm and will never work for a firm like that.
How many section corners have you found in LA?
Robert Hill, post: 441051, member: 378 wrote: Why are you being a troll Ahole?
Robert, please refrain from talking to ladies in such a manner...;)
Scott Ellis, post: 441057, member: 7154 wrote: Actually that part is true, we did look for and found plenty of the section corners. I was also 18 not 20. My choice of drink has never been Dr. Pepper but a good deal of Texans love Dr. Pepper.
I have never worked for a lossey goosey surveying firm and will never work for a firm like that.
How many section corners have you found in LA?
Originals - 4
Cypress post in Assumption Parish
2 Heartwood pine posts in St Tammany Parish
Custom Limestone post in Destrahan Louisiana on an old sugar plantation on an arpent tract.
Section corners established by Parish Surveyors/Engineers from about 1920 through 1950s - Numerous
Usually a stout pipe or even concrete marker. No telling that they were in the original position. Most used as a tie to a M&B surveys
I imagine in Northern and Central Louisiana that one can have a better chance of finding original corners and the PLSS exists in a more user friendly manner. Also on lands that are large timber tracts (that probably don't exist in Texas)
It is possible too despite timber operations.
You weren't boundary surveying here.
Pipeline, Seismic or well location surveys weren't required to properly delineate boundaries. They used these so called found corners to orientate their projects in a loosey goose kind of way. So that is what you were doing.
Sorry to break the news to you.
Robert Hill, post: 441064, member: 378 wrote: Originals - 4
Cypress post in Assumption Parish
2 Heartwood pine posts in St Tammany Parish
Custom Limestone post in Destrahan Louisiana on an old sugar plantation on an arpent tract.Section corners established by Parish Surveyors/Engineers from about 1920 through 1950s - Numerous
Usually a stout pipe or even concrete marker. No telling that they were in the original position. Most used as a tie to a M&B surveysI imagine in Northern and Central Louisiana that one can have a better chance of finding original corners and the PLSS exists in a more user friendly manner. Also on lands that are large timber tracts (that probably don't exist in Texas)
It is possible too despite timber operations.
You weren't boundary surveying here.
Pipeline, Seismic or well location surveys weren't required to properly delineate boundaries. They used these so called found corners to orientate their projects in a loosey goose kind of way. So that is what you were doing.
Sorry to break the news to you.
What makes you think I was spending my time in LA on a Pipeline, Seismic or well location survey?
I may have saw an ad for a Survey Company that read: Tired of Louisiana workers need real men to work for the Boundary Survey Firm, Texans hired on the spot.
Or maybe I was working on a boundary survey crew while dating a girl who went to LSU.
Lucky for us all, we now have perfectly square sections in Colorado. I have a few in my county, and I am told that we are getting more and more around the state. Thanks to GPS, all those old transit - unsquare surveys can be discarded. The mountainous terrain is no longer an obstacle. All the landowners and surveyors can now be informed that the lines we faithfully retraced and relied upon, peacefully, professionally, and in good faith, for decades, are now correct thanks to superior measurements and superior surveyors.
Scott Ellis, post: 441067, member: 7154 wrote: What makes you think I was spending my time in LA on a Pipeline, Seismic or well location survey?
I may have saw ....
classic....
Scott Ellis, post: 441067, member: 7154 wrote:
Or maybe I was working on a boundary survey crew while dating a girl who went to LSU.
If that was true, you wouldn't be living in Texas 😉
Scott Ellis, post: 441011, member: 7154 wrote: Its a real question, Any PLSS State, mix of private and public.
I keep hearing nothing is square in PLSS. Well why is it not square it should be. DId the PLSS Surveyor's get the grid wrong on the very first square and threw off all the other grids? Why come two or more Surveyors in the same surveying in the same section, can't match on where a corner should be set. The system is designed to use any corners found in that section to reset any corners in the original location.
You should consider Politics (or Law), your use of "redirect" and "vague" is mastered... You have outpaced even Kent
Robert Hill, post: 441071, member: 378 wrote: If that was true, you wouldn't be living in Texas 😉
You made have just Checkmated me
