So, this....
When SUE and the laws around them now including the penalties for not locating or knowing where your underground facilities exist, this seems like the person spraying the paint wasn't trained properly and might need to be retrained to fully grasp what the level of commitment and responsibilities are for marking and indicating the potential hazards of the facilities they are locating....
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jeesh.....
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Yeah, that's no help. How did you code it? ???? ?ÿ
well duh....it's red.?ÿ Electric...
lol.
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I had to walk around to figure out which UGE this was...
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Best one was the UGG behind a rock.....that I saw after I had picked up.......
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Not all locators are equally trained....
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That's within the tolerance they attempt to maintain.?ÿ Would be nice to know which way is thataway, though.?ÿ Anything other than a main line inside the private property is a crapshoot at best.
nailed it...they were using dots to not mark up the area too much....ftw???
I was more or less wondering wtf you sprayed the dot under the planter where I'll never get an accurate leveled shot on it either....
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I have known some locate companies to put down a dot as a possible location and then come back and line it when they are certain.
I worked for a shop with an in house locator back in the day, if he could not figure it out with the metrotech he would break out the dowsing rods. A sure fire way to upset certain city inspectors if they happen to see you painting up locates based on bent brass rods.
In a perfect world companies showing underground locates would hire and build relationships with reputable locating companies instead of relying on circumstance and locating whatever happens to be there or playing hanky with fraud and announcing to utility companies that they are going to dig and disturb and need a paint out.
The regional differences in paint locate trip me out a little when traveling, I noticed in Toronto one time little stamped mons with the util and a down along with color coding on one site. In Raleigh NC some blocks are covered in paint that is really quite ugly and even despite strong presence does not look correct to the casual observations of a passing tourist.
We should have a show and share of disclaimers that everyone puts on their maps regarding locates. lol
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Merry Christmas everyone! I am absolutely sure that taking a few minutes of of my morning to check on activity here was a totally productive and worthwhile use of time!
All I see in the photographs is a red paint spot; nothing more. I would note it as such, and not assume any liability for the presence of an underground utility. Any underground utilities on maps that I have made are the ones that I can actually see.
In my experience "shot in the dark" utility marking services are always wrong. Why people trust those with up to three weeks of training on what color to paint their shoes is beyond my comprehension.
Construction personnel may be putting their lives in danger by relying on these paint marks to be anything but paint marks. Take, for example a 350 K volt electrical duct bank that was actually directly under a drilling rig, but was "marked" at twenty feet from the drill location.
In my mind, paying for actual location of underground utilities like Subsurface Utility Engineering is essential. Even if the life of one construction laborer is saved it is worth the money.
There are more red blue yellow orange and green dots....
This one was particularly annoying due to its proximity to the base of a planter, and then the converging or diverging other red dots that went in all other cardinal directions, or were coming from them.....
Dots are inadequate, esp when theyre distant to each other.
instead of relying on circumstance and locating whatever happens to be there or playing hanky with fraud and announcing to utility companies that they are going to dig and disturb and need a paint out.
In colorado, the laws changed in 2018....if youre a UFO (underground facility owner) youre now legally liable and criminally punishable if youre not giving locates and engineered drawings that insure 18 inches or less of distance from your facilities.?ÿ Its a real problem that will be unfolding for years....
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Utility markings are always inadequate. Guessing the utility location can have dire consequences.
Our DOT made a recent announcement that Subsurface Utility Engineering (S.U.E.) will be mandatory in their construction contracts. That, along with vacuum excavation for verification will finally make things safer for construction crews.
When I worked with a S.U.E. outfit we were always underutilized because contractor companies could get the "shot in the dark" utility locators free.
Goes to show you just how much they undervalue the lives of their employees.
Contractors have no problem putting a 15% markup on the cost of hydro-vacuuming. ?ÿIt??s just as likely that the client hasn??t wanted to pay the additional cost. Good to see the client accepting financial responsibility and engineering firms finding a way to cash in on work performed by others. Lots of vac trucks are owned by contractors, not many owned by engineering firms.?ÿ
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could get the "shot in the dark" utility locators free.
We used to refer to those guys as "spray and pray"?ÿ
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Yeah, utility locates are frustrating. The service is provided for those who are going to be digging. Not those who need it for design. You hand dig to find it and once found follow it. Fun stuff! ?ÿHigh voltage and critical fiber optic should be encased in concrete ductwork and as build??s should be done prior to backfilling. Based on what I??ve seen a few times that isn??t always the case if a crew isn??t on site.
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Even when you can see a utility you can get in trouble.?ÿ A firm here in Atlanta did a topo on an existing car wash site.?ÿ They opened the meter box and noted a 2 inch water meter and 2 inch line exiting the meter box so they noted a 2 inch water line on the map.?ÿ Construction on the new site was nearly complete when the water line was to be hooked up.?ÿ OOOOOPS!!! it's a 1 inch line and not suitable for the use of the site.?ÿ The water line exited the box and almost immediately was reduced to 1 inch.?ÿ Lots of concrete paving was cut, dug up and replaced to place correct the size water line.?ÿ You can bet that anyone associated with that survey now will note "2 inch water meter" and NOT "2 inch water line" ever again.
Andy
Are we supposed to be trained in plumbing, electrical engineering, telecommunications, etc., in order to properly identify utilities? Sometimes I think we should be.
Of course not. ?ÿOnly have the same expectations for ourselves that we have for others. ?ÿ
In Virginia, engineers, architects and other design professionals can initiate a "design ticket" for new projects (entirely different from a standard locate request) upon which utility owners "stakeholders" are required to provide a higher level of detail as to the location of their infrastructure and engage with the design team as to the impact any proposed work will have on existing utilities.?ÿ Locates are marked in the field at this time and reviewed for accuracy by the stakeholders. The process is not perfect, but is leaps and bounds beyond the normal spray and pray marks.
Not all site designers avail themself of this service unfortunately.
You mean someone out there goes entirely by the paint??ÿ When I did any drafting of utilities I'd always tried to get a hold of facility maps as well to help confirm what I was drawing.
SUE design and responsibilities have been dealing with the sins of the past and the changes on the laws and liability.?ÿ
I really upended the apple cart of the water utility where I worked when I had the unmitigated gaul to take some stamped engineering drawings and then calculate the locations of nonexistent water services and Mains
They were all hemming and hawing and accusing me of not knowing anything about what I was doing..
then the potholing hit everything I had calculated and they got out the black spray paint and covered their marks, and avoided making eye contact and even sent a supervisor to tell me I was out of line and not allowed to call in locates and blah blah blah...
They had been painting those marks for decades.?ÿ Talk about wasting the public trust ...
