leegreen, post: 414265, member: 2332 wrote: Make sure what ever you buy, add a good winch. Get winch rope, not a metal cable.
Front AND Rear??
Kris Morgan, post: 414357, member: 29 wrote: Not at all. A 10 mile pipeline we staked paid for ours, which we bought it for that project. That was 7 years ago now and the equipment is still going strong.
Good for you. As said, I don't know his scope or how it's priced. Also, some of the power companies don't allow use of an ATV, 4x4, etc, depending on the line. We get some projects T&M or not a not to exceed price. So, depending on what he's doing and the how the budget is structured, it mightn't make sense to do it.
Also, some of our power lines have access roads where they use mats in swamps for construction, and remove them when they're done. No one's driving anything through some of these areas. Same with hills, where the old roads are washed out or destroyed.
Shawn Billings, post: 414271, member: 6521 wrote: All that shock and vibration has to go somewhere. Are your homemade mounts built to offer some give or are they rigid. Consider that the manufactured components rattled to pieces and now all of that shock is going to the equipment instead (again, unless you have some shock absorption in your mounts).
Shawn,
Most of the damage came from the torque created by the meter plus pole required to get the receiver above the rider. Even Seco's ATV mount with the stabilizing struts lasted about a year before they were unusable. Basically, the weight of the receiver acts like a reverse pendulum. If you look at Seco's literature they show the system with a much lighter discrete GNSS antenna versus the heavier integrated receiver such as a GS16 or R10. If you Mounting directly to the roll cage eliminates these forces. As a note, none of the commercial mounts that I have used had any kind of dampening or shock system.
Some photos from 2011 (I know a "guy" that knows his surveying, welding, etc.). It still works like a dream:
Knows bicycles too, evidently.
Shawn Billings, post: 414223, member: 6521 wrote: I'll have to start using a fieldbook again...
Seriously though, I spent 3k on the four wheeler plus another 2k on a trailer. On the right big jobs, it's saving 20% of my time in the field. How do we make it up? Volume? I'm thinking I need a daily charge rate (at least to apply to my calculation for job estimates if not on itemized billing) for the four wheeler. I'm thinking $250/day. If I use it one week per month (and that seems like a pretty good estimate), that's 60 days per year that it would see use which figures to 60*$250=$15,000. This sounds like a lot, but it must recoup the cost of investment (5k) and make up for the loss of billable hours which would be about 15 days. The $250 per day starts to look pretty thin then, considering my goal is to be around $1000/field day (although my bottom line is lower).
Of course, it's not just about the financial side. The four-wheeler definitely reduces wear and tear on the body improving job satisfaction (so long as I don't get it stuck... but that's a story I won't go into.)
I think $250/day is pretty outrageous and I am following your thinking but...
Isn't diminishing hours on one project making more projects possible.
When we did government work that needed ATVs, it was a daily charge rate
that included cost of operations and modest profit mark-up.
Last year, a group of parents rented one of those party buses with driver for an evening for a group
Of boys gong to the Superdome to see a game, It had room for 20 people and fridge and big flatscreen tv etc. it had a stripper pole too. ; ). It wasn't that much more far north of your ATV.
I would figure cost of operation for one day, upkeep and other maintenance, gas, insurance, registration etc etc etc
And then add 10-15% profit mark up.
Yeah, but what did it cost when you factor in the stripper?
Robert Hill, post: 414400, member: 378 wrote: I think $250/day is pretty outrageous and I am following your thinking but...
Isn't diminishing hours on one project making more projects possible.
When we did government work that needed ATVs, it was a daily charge rate
that included cost of operations and modest profit mark-up.
Last year, a group of parents rented one of those party buses with driver for an evening for a group
Of boys gong to the Superdome to see a game, It had room for 20 people and fridge and big flatscreen tv etc. it had a stripper pole too. ; ). It wasn't that much more far north of your ATV.I would figure cost of operation for one day, upkeep and other maintenance, gas, insurance, registration etc etc etc
And then add 10-15% profit mark up.
Could be high. I see what you are saying.
I would argue that investing in something that only allows you to increase volume without increasing profit would be a poor business model. If I can make $5000/week doing 1 job or make $5000/week doing 2 jobs after investing in some expensive piece of equipment, I'd say that really doesn't make sense. I realize that's not exactly what you mean, but at some point, you have to figure in an increased profit margin after an investment. I doubt I'd ever put that rate on an itemized invoice, but I would put that number in my calculations for lump sum proposals. My usual calculation is how many days estimated to complete a job x amount per day with consideration given to value (i.e. just because I can do it fast doesn't mean I should do it cheap). If I start figuring that with a 4 wheeler I can do a 4 day job in 3 days, I need to figure the ROI into the proposal.
When you have a atv, you also have to figure in costs of maintenance. Tires, oil changes, brake jobs, etc. And now that you can do a 30 care tract in a shorter time should be an argument for adding in a fee for the use of the atv. Don't go giving your time away just because you can do it faster, you can only do it faster BECAUSE you spent $10,000! Get that money back!
tomchurch, post: 414198, member: 10174 wrote: We are about to start a big utility line project that is about 17 miles long. The terrain is rough and washed out, sometimes steep, and often overgrown. While a 4x4 truck will get to some of it we'll need something else for the majority of it. I've never bought a side-by-side or quad before so I would appreciate any advice or experiences. Specifically any thoughts on using two quads vs. a side-by-side along this type of terrain? Features to look for? Amount of suspension? Brand recommendations?
Tom,
One deciding factor may be the legal aspect of a UTV vs an ATV. In New York State you can not register a UTV that weighs more than 1000lbs, which covers most of them. An ATV can be registered.
Robert Hill, post: 414400, member: 378 wrote: I think $250/day is pretty outrageous and I am following your thinking but...
Isn't diminishing hours on one project making more projects possible.
Robert,
Two points on your post. First, while I agree $250 a day might seem high, what the cost to rent one be? Like any other tool, this should be thought of as profit center, I need a return on my investment.
Secondly, as for the ability to perform more work because I invest in more productive equipment I fondly remember my first boss's words "I would rather work half as much for twice the pay". I'm still waiting for the day all of my high tech equipment will allow me to relax. Instead, because clients (and apparently other surveyors) seems to think that since I can get the work done faster that they should be the recipients of the savings derived from my capital expense, I have to work just as much if not more to stay ahead of the game. Bottom line is that we should not purchase equipment for the benefit of the client but rather ours.
John Putnam, post: 414573, member: 1188 wrote: Robert,
Two points on your post. First, while I agree $250 a day might seem high, what the cost to rent one be? Like any other tool, this should be thought of as profit center, I need a return on my investment.
Secondly, as for the ability to perform more work because I invest in more productive equipment I fondly remember my first boss's words "I would rather work half as much for twice the pay". I'm still waiting for the day all of my high tech equipment will allow me to relax. Instead, because clients (and apparently other surveyors) seems to think that since I can get the work done faster that they should be the recipients of the savings derived from my capital expense, I have to work just as much if not more to stay ahead of the game. Bottom line is that we should not purchase equipment for the benefit of the client but rather ours.
I so agree we need to charge for the Value or our service, not our Time.
I have always charged the ATV on a per hour basis, trucks on a per mile basis.
I would get the ATV, at times a side by side is nice, but they need a trailer, the ATV doesn't and the side by side can't go where my ATV can.
Also I've had side by sides stuck and you can really hate life about then.
If what you are doing is setting out fence posts all day long the extra space in the side by side is a must.
I think if you planned it carefully, a small trailer could be built that transported the ATV AND could be pulled behind the ATV to transport equipment/materials.
They are a PIA to turn around! But for specific jobs, they could be very useful.
