"this is julie ballwrecker, esq. we have some comments regarding the 9 ALTA surveys you recently completed, specifically regarding zoning setbacks. we would like to see them depicted on the face of the survey in addition to the setbacks of record. oh, and if you could have that done in the next two hours that'd be great. we need to close on these at 3:30 and this is holding it up."
"wow, 3:30. congratulations. i conveniently listed the zoning setbacks in table form on the face of each survey for the following reasons: first, the language of local zoning setbacks is incredibly vague and open to interpretation, and we are dealing with irregularly shaped tracts. if you can determine, for instance, where the rear property line is on this particular tract, please feel free to do so. the second reason would be so you might actually be able to read the map now that i've added about 400 layers of junk that your esteemed colleagues have requested. that is precisely why i am not in the business of graphically plotting zoning setbacks."
"but... we have to have this, and you're being anything but cooperative."
"i apologize, but this is as cooperative as i can be given a deadline of two hours. i may have been able to be more accommodating had i gotten this call at any point up to three and a half weeks ago, when you first received the surveys."
"i'm going to have my paralegal draft an email and we'll tell you where the setbacks need to go. will that work?"
*mistakenly thinking this was either a joke or a completely impossible folly given the time involved* "sure, have at it."
3:15 i get an email with about 30 different specific setbacks on 9 different tracts. best part is they're all over the place (including, no joke, an 82.10' setback).
"okay, you've got the email, will you plot those now?"
"sure thing. just tell me whose name i need to credit these setbacks to on the face of the surveys. should i put 'juile ballwrecker, esq.?'"
"wh.. wha... wha... no, you can't put my name on there! why would you want to do that?"
"well, if i'm correct- you're an attorney. in pennsylvania. you just dictated to me, a surveyor in austin, texas, how i should depict zoning setbacks on a survey of property in austin, texas based upon the city of austin zoning requirements. is that correct?"
"well, you said you didn't know how to."
"that's right. and i've been trying for a long time. so if i'm going to show them on my survey i'm certainly going to give credit where credit is due for my sudden epiphany."
"but, but no, that's not going to work."
"okay. well, figure out who in your office would like to accept responsibility for somebody else's judgement and make sure and get back to me with that name. i'll be needing that info by 3:25. thanks."
*SLOW CLAP!
That's the funniest danged thing I've read in a while.
When I was doing those the commercial setbacks would be like: one story 25', two story 50', but if the area is landscaped 15', if the area is parking, 35', like how am I supposed to know what your future construction project might be? The Architect is supposed to figure out code issues like that.
flyin solo, post: 398308, member: 8089 wrote: ..first, the language of local zoning setbacks is incredibly vague and open to interpretation..
This reminds me of a survey I prepared once and some height and height restrictions were included to be shown on the survey. Now I've measured structure heights before and never had any problem showing them on the survey. But I was asked as to state as to whether the height exceeded the zoning code provided with all the info and the ordinance stated, "The height of the building shall be measured at 90 degrees." ...that's all it said...
And when I tried to bring this to the client's attention for some sort of explanation all could hear on the other end of the phone was chirping crickets....
"incredibly vague" indeed....
(for you local surveyors it was in Nichols Hills - 😉 )
We had a parking lot over the building setback line and were asked to label the parking lot as an encroachment.
Well, I suppose you could assume 90å¡ fahrenheit? I understand things tend to expand and contract with the temperature.
paden cash, post: 398321, member: 20 wrote: "The height of the building shall be measured at 90 degrees." ...that's all it said...
Well, I suppose you could assume 90å¡ fahrenheit? I understand things tend to expand and contract with the temperature.
PA PLS, post: 398325, member: 9658 wrote: We had a parking lot over the building setback line and were asked to label the parking lot as an encroachment.
She was only about the fifth attorney on this project to whom I had to explain that defining an encroachment was the job of the caller and not the callee.
paden cash, post: 398321, member: 20 wrote: Now I've measured structure heights before and never had any problem showing them on the survey. But I was asked as to state as to whether the height exceeded the zoning code provided with all the info and the ordinance stated, "The height of the building shall be measured at 90 degrees." ...that's all it said...
Well, if the building was in Oklahoma - which seems likely - they didn't want you to measure its height on a slant to make it appear that it was a two-story trailer, right?
flyin solo, post: 398308, member: 8089 wrote: "okay, you've got the email, will you plot those now?"
"sure thing. just tell me whose name i need to credit these setbacks to on the face of the surveys. should i put 'juile ballwrecker, esq.?'"
"wh.. wha... wha... no, you can't put my name on there! why would you want to do that?"
That gambit is the mark of true insight. One of the most important functions of an attorney in a commercial real estate transaction is to shift liability for as much as possible to some hapless surveyor (and by extension any title insurer so foolish as to delete the survey exceptions clause in the title policy) who under the pressure of frantic telephone calls and emails can be persuaded to sign his life away giving an opinion on some legal matter that no prudent attorney would be willing to.
This would be absolutely hilarious but there are silly people out there who truly believe we will do anything they say because we are all a bunch of sniveling idiots with no gonads.
Table A, Item 6 specifies that if zoning setbacks are to be shown they are to be supplied by the insurer. Ms. Ballwrecker, Esq., should know that.
Kent McMillan, post: 398340, member: 3 wrote: One of the most important functions of an attorney in a commercial real estate transaction is to shift liability for as much as possible to some hapless surveyor (and by extension any title insurer so foolish as to delete the survey exceptions clause in the title policy) who under the pressure of frantic telephone calls and emails can be persuaded to sign his life away giving an opinion on some legal matter that no prudent attorney would be willing to.
I was on the phone with a title insurance company attorney a few years ago during the "addressing comments" phase of an ALTA survey discussing his and the lenders comments and referred to the final week of the ALTA survey process as "the Ceremonial Exchanging of the Liabilities". I believe I actually heard him spit his coffee out.
How many times have we heard that we were "being less than operative" or "we have never had trouble with a surveyor doing this in the past"? Thank you Flying Solo :clink: for standing up for yourself and the rest of us. Title attorneys will give us as much liability as we will accept. I have told more than one that my job is not to make their life easy. I am to provide a service to my Client in accordance with our contractual obligations. Among my obligations is to not certify anything that I can not certify. Certifying a set back that is open to interpretation is not in my or my Client's best interest. How many times have we seen the reviewer with a municipality determine a set back and we just did not agree?
big shock- came in to the office this morning and haven't yet heard back from her.
i sure hope this managed to close yesterday somehow...
Bravo! I shall end my week on that note.