Bite your tongue, smile and keep on trucking. It's a right of passage. We all have our fair share of stories from our past about the dreaded "red pencil". A time will come that you will be the PLS you speak of.
Until then, it is his stamp and name being recorded on a plat for the test of time and the final product should be the representation he desires. You will have your particular style when you begin stamping your seal.
Your only complaint, still very questionable, would be if he was very inconstant in his style. Such as telling you to use a certain font or style for a particular item and changing it everytime you prepare a new plat.
I trained under multiple surveyors and each had completely different styles and methods for descriptions, plats, reports, etc. Sometimes I would think I had a beautiful final product in my early years only to get back a Picasso looking paper because of the "Mark-ups" all over it.
I'm sure the comments you overheard felt degrading or insulting but don't take it to seriously. It all part of the right of passage.
I actually missed some of your further comments in the thread. My previous post was to the particular desires of the PLS only.
If he did in fact use you as a scape goat for missing a deadline and this is the first time, I would let let it go. But if this is habitual, the matter should be addressed professionally. I would first talk with the PLS himself about your concerns and feelings. If he is a professional, the two of you should be able to come to an understanding and create steps to eliminate the problem for future projects. I believe stepping over him and going to the owner/boss would only create further tension and a volatile work place.
I wouldn't make the issue personal, but a matter of improving work flow and a more efficient work place. Stating things personally gives the impression of trying to make excuses or whining. Keeping the issue business related appears more professional and of interest to everyone involved.
Trundle, post: 391427, member: 12120 wrote: After competing my first job (ALTA) at a new company, my boss (the only PLS in the office) gave me a list of revisions that were all based on personal preferences. Change the font, don't abbreviate the word Township, different symbols, rewording some of the notes etc...
I made all the revisions and thought all was well. Earlier this week, I heard the owner of the company talking with my boss about the client being disappointed by our missing a deadline. My boss explained how I wasn't very experienced and he was going to have to "hold my hand for a while". All of this based on his personal preference, which was never conveyed to me before thise comments.
I have 10+ years of experience surveying, and plan on taking the PS exam next year. Now, I feel like I should be lookong for a new job.
Anyone else experience this? Any advice?
I don't think you should take it personally. It sounds to me like your boss could have chosen a better way of saying it, but he was trying to express that you were not yet familiar with his company's way of doing things. I don't take it as though he was questioning your ability. Lots of firms like for everything they send out to look the same, and it takes a while for new people to learn their system.
I like to give people the benefit of the doubt - for a while. If he really does like to blame others for problems he could have prevented, then maybe this is the wrong place to be.
Shame on him not providing an example. However, I will always be very detailed and specific with a new employee's first plat. I will not hold the employee responsible for my preferences if I have not let them know what they are. I would suggest that you let him know that you care about producing acceptable work in the best interest of the Company. I must confess that when I first became a Department Manager that I was a terrible boss. Many of us are put in management to fill a vacuum without training or experience. Work with him and he most likely will appreciate it. In the end, you teach people how to treat you.
In my opinion, the drafting is much harder to turn over to someone else to do than the fieldwork. At the end of the day if the new guy in the field is learning and he messes up then he gets to do it over. This involves sweat and blood at times, so the process and techniques are learned quickly. On the mapping/drafting end of it, the lessons are learned by doing the revisions from the markups and it takes a lot longer to learn how to do it like the boss wants. I do all of my drafting and office work, If I were to hire someone to take over the drafting and some of the office work, I would expect I would have them set with me for several weeks doing the work and holding their hand. Holding the hand of a new hire is part of it. If the project was that important then the LS should have realized that and took steps to get it finished, not wait until it's time and say I should have been holding his hand. He should have been holding your hand until he was comfortable enough with your work.
lmbrls, post: 391610, member: 6823 wrote: Shame on him not providing an example. However, I will always be very detailed and specific with a new employee's first plat. I will not hold the employee responsible for my preferences if I have not let them know what they are. I would suggest that you let him know that you care about producing acceptable work in the best interest of the Company. I must confess that when I first became a Department Manager that I was a terrible boss. Many of us are put in management to fill a vacuum without training or experience. Work with him and he most likely will appreciate it. In the end, you teach people how to treat you.
Imbrls, you are not alone in missing the point, that the company CAD manual was followed. Being that there is only one PLS that CAD manual should reflect his standards. It is his responsibility to see that the manual is updated.
Paul in PA
Basically you see that it is what it is, here. I agree with pretty much everything that has been said.
As you proceed down the trail toward becoming a Professional Land Surveyor you will find that it is imperative that we teach what we know to others in order to maintain our status. You will teach clients, owners, neighbors, Boy Scouts, and employees. Learn to teach and you will become a more rounded individual and achieve the status of being a Professional. Its not all numbers and stakes.
The boss sounds like a p*ssy form blaming missing a deadline on someone who works for him. It's his responsibility to make sure it gets done on time. Why did it take almost 2 full work days to give you back a red line on something that HAD to go out by Friday? Especially if that red line was presumably minimal...
We've all been through stuff like this. You've only been there 2 weeks, so you can't really do much about it. Just try to learn from what happened and see if you can avoid a similar issue coming up again. Just keep plugging along....
We're hearing only one side here. I've handed stuff off only to get it back on 3:30 on the day it's due, and not everything has been fixed. And sometimes I care about the little crap, like abbreviations, and sometimes I don't. But if it's abbreviated in one place, and then it's spelt out in another, the inconsistencies tend to look bad.
Like I don't care if it's just 500/456 for the deed book and page, or if it's Bk 500 Pg 456. But it should be consistent throughout the plan, or plans, if you're doing more than one for a client.
This is the way that we've missed some deadlines, and I'm sure that someone else thinks that it's because I'm being too picky.
Paul in PA, post: 391612, member: 236 wrote: Imbrls, you are not alone in missing the point, that the company CAD manual was followed. Being that there is only one PLS that CAD manual should reflect his standards. It is his responsibility to see that the manual is updated.
Although to be fair, there wasn't much to the cad manual. It looked like it was from 20 years ago with most of it being instructions on how to edit a viewport, etc... The only mention of cad style was to "follow the template" (which I did).
Also, part of it is that at my last company (in another state), my boss was not picky at all. He would review the boundary/easements (if he reviewed anything at all). The symbols, abbreviations, etc....didn't matter to him. I still stayed consistent, and was good enough at doing those he didn't really have to spend a lot of time reviewing them (the boundaries were all in platted subdivisions or based on previous survey work the company had done). The fact I was able to replicate that in another state in another company made me feel a lot of pride - only to have it torn down because of Arial font.
Trundle, post: 391646, member: 12120 wrote: Although to be fair, there wasn't much to the cad manual. It looked like it was from 20 years ago with most of it being instructions on how to edit a viewport, etc... The only mention of cad style was to "follow the template" (which I did).
Also, part of it is that at my last company (in another state), my boss was not picky at all. He would review the boundary/easements (if he reviewed anything at all). The symbols, abbreviations, etc....didn't matter to him. I still stayed consistent, and was good enough at doing those he didn't really have to spend a lot of time reviewing them (the boundaries were all in platted subdivisions or based on previous survey work the company had done). The fact I was able to replicate that in another state in another company made me feel a lot of pride - only to have it torn down because of Arial font.
I am a little surprise the company had you start from scratch, and didn't do a save as from a recent ALTA survey they just completed, which would have had the font and style the Surveyor prefers, and they that also didn't provide you with a few print copies as well.
A couple of random thoughts:
First, when your manager threw you under the bus to the head honcho, don't assume that the big boss heard "Trundle is incompetent and a bad hire", he may have heard "Man that PLS I have working for is a piss poor manager...first he fails to property manage his new hire then tries to shunt the blame off on the new guy, what an a$$hole"
Second, I somewhat take exception to the general idea that stylistic drafting decisions are nothing more than "personal preferences". A survey plat is a graphic means to transmit information; to analogize it's similar to a written language. Many of us have spent a lot of time developing what we think is the best way to use this language, especially to use it in a way that, at least to us, decreases the chance for misunderstanding. For me at least, sometimes what may at first look like personal preference is the result of a long process of trial and error. When this has blown over, it might not be a bad idea to ask your manager to explain his method behind the (apparent) madness).
Comments about poor work should be saved for those who really are poor consistently. Even then it should be a private conversation intended to either terminate the incompetent employee or to develop a plan to attempt to train the poor employee so that a proper work product will be produced.
Many years ago I worked in a department where the department clerk was to do all the typing of documents leaving our department. This was a Union position, by the way. You had no influence over who occupied which job and their level of skills. This young woman couldn't spell her own name the same way twice in a row. She was absolutely the worst typist I have ever known. People who hunt and peck with one or two fingers can do a far superior job to what she delivered. What made this especially exasperating was that nearly everything she typed had four carbon copies being made at the same time. A single typo required several minutes to correct on all the copies. Many times she had to start over completely. Once she had it typed to the satisfaction of the one who gave it to her, it would go to the department head. He might insist on changes. Then it was retyped until it met approval of both the original worker and the department head. Then it went to the division director's secretary. She could insist on changes. Repeat the process. Then the division director would eventually see it and might insist on changes and start the process over. Then it would reach the secretary of the plant manager. Same story. Then on to the plant manager. Same story. Then it went to the top dog with the US Army on the other side of the building. Same story if he was going to forward this on up his chain of command.
To top it off, they refused to purchase simple computers with word processing capability that were available at the time. Torture. Pure torture.
Holy Cow, post: 391472, member: 50 wrote: Worked with a fellow shortly after graduating college who had a terrible stutter. He didn't start out that way. It began while working for a boss who was incredibly abusive to his employees. When he was especially upset he would jump up onto the desk of the worker and scream down at him.
I'd have pushed his ass off my desk if he had pulled that stunt with me.
Didn't have time to read any other than the OP, so others have probably said something similar.
The one stamping it has to be satisfied with the content, even down to personal preferences. Whether or not making changes to make the drawing fit one's style is worth missing a deadline is a matter of judgment for the person signing the map. But that person needs to take responsibility for their decisions in that regard.
If I'm working for someone else and they treat me well, which includes taking responsibility for the effect of their decisions on the outcomes of projects and giving me credit for the good I do for the organization, I will bend over backwards to do what I can to make them look good, which includes helping to get them out of a jam when things go sideways for whatever reason.
But if my boss is blaming their failures on me or the people working under me when they're talking to their boss or a client, then they've lost my trust. As a new employee, I'd probably start forming the exit plan, and when the time is right to move on, just tell the boss you're leaving thanks, but you just don't think it will work out.
