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Interesting boundary dispute

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tommy-young
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About 3 years ago, we surveyed this corner lot. It was the western most lot of an several lots that had been created decades ago. They all share the same continuous north line, and the south line is the road. We found some old monuments that we thought fit somewhat reasonably well, but in the process, had to reject some latter set rebars with caps, but those were not on our lot.

The client did not like our survey. They repeatedly came into this office to argue how it was wrong.

During this time, the neighbors built a fence on what we said was the boundary line.

After the fence was built, our client hired a different surveyor, who came up with a different answer. The result is the front corner moves about 8 feet east, and the back corner moves about 8 feet west.

So now, our original client is suing the neighbor, using the second survey, and rejecting our survey. The neighbor that didn't hire us is relying on our survey.


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 10:45 am
paden-cash
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"Oh what a web we weave..."

Differing boundary results from the same forensic data set is sadly a part of world. Hopefully your survey shows what you found, what you relied upon and what you discounted. And in most cases I've seen of this nature, there probably are multiple "boundary" lines in the ground. We're not a recording state so at times it can be difficult to determine who did what and when.

I hope your original client isn't foolish enough to try and drag you into the swill. My gut feeling his only complaint could be negligence on your part. He's not by any means the first property owner to have a survey performed and then dislike the results. Sounds like the neighbor is loving this.

This is a good example of the fact that EVERY boundary survey performed affects multiple parties. Good luck on this one.....


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 11:06 am
RADAR
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paden cash, post: 381554, member: 20 wrote: This is a good example of the fact that EVERY boundary survey performed affects multiple parties. Good luck on this one.....

And another good example for the plus column in RECORDING REQUIREMENT.


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 11:21 am
Jp7191
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Tommy Young, post: 381549, member: 703 wrote: About 3 years ago, we surveyed this corner lot. It was the western most lot of an several lots that had been created decades ago. They all share the same continuous north line, and the south line is the road. We found some old monuments that we thought fit somewhat reasonably well, but in the process, had to reject some latter set rebars with caps, but those were not on our lot.

The client did not like our survey. They repeatedly came into this office to argue how it was wrong.

During this time, the neighbors built a fence on what we said was the boundary line.

After the fence was built, our client hired a different surveyor, who came up with a different answer. The result is the front corner moves about 8 feet east, and the back corner moves about 8 feet west.

So now, our original client is suing the neighbor, using the second survey, and rejecting our survey. The neighbor that didn't hire us is relying on our survey.

On a side note, did your office ever get a call or notice from the second "Professional" surveyor to discuss the difference in professional opinions? Jp


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 11:40 am
lmbrls
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RADAR, post: 381557, member: 413 wrote: And another good example for the plus column in RECORDING REQUIREMENT.

Believe me. Those of us that are not in a Recording State would love to see this change. Hopefully, this would reduce the number of pin farms.


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 11:45 am

tommy-young
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RADAR, post: 381557, member: 413 wrote: And another good example for the plus column in RECORDING REQUIREMENT.

The other surveyor had our survey. I gave it to him.


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 1:45 pm
RADAR
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Tommy Young, post: 381573, member: 703 wrote: The other surveyor had our survey. I gave it to him.

So, what did you say to him when he called and told you he found that your east corners were off 8'?


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 2:45 pm
tommy-young
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RADAR, post: 381577, member: 413 wrote: So, what did you say to him when he called and told you he found that your east corners were off 8'?

I don't exactly remember the specifics, but I didn't change the survey.


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 3:06 pm
paul-in-pa
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Tommy Young, post: 381549, member: 703 wrote: About 3 years ago, we surveyed this corner lot. It was the western most lot of an several lots that had been created decades ago. They all share the same continuous north line, and the south line is the road. We found some old monuments that we thought fit somewhat reasonably well, but in the process, had to reject some latter set rebars with caps, but those were not on our lot.

The client did not like our survey. They repeatedly came into this office to argue how it was wrong.

During this time, the neighbors built a fence on what we said was the boundary line.

After the fence was built, our client hired a different surveyor, who came up with a different answer. The result is the front corner moves about 8 feet east, and the back corner moves about 8 feet west.

So now, our original client is suing the neighbor, using the second survey, and rejecting our survey. The neighbor that didn't hire us is relying on our survey.

I would suspect you may have enough prior data collected to figure out a possible scheme he may have used to change the side lines.

The neighbor using your survey may have some recourse against you. Was a title insurance company originally involved?

Had you ever asked your client why he though you were wrong? It is very likely the other surveyor did and may have found what you did not know to look for.

Paul in PA


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 3:14 pm
seb
 seb
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How long is the side line? Having a total of 16 feet of displacement from front to rear would be introducing a significant rotation that should be very easy to spot which is correct once other adjoining boundaries are checked.

Please add my vote to the recording states are good pile. For the integrity of the cadastre, claiming that only the client who paid for the data is entitled to it is short sighted.


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 5:44 pm

RADAR
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Seb, post: 381601, member: 7509 wrote: How long is the side line? Having a total of 16 feet of displacement from front to rear would be introducing a significant rotation

I missed this when I first read the OP: His front corner is 8' east and the back corner is 8' west of your corners? And you feel confident enough in your survey that you are not changing it?

Tommy Young, post: 381581, member: 703 wrote: I don't exactly remember the specifics, but I didn't change the survey.

And the other surveyor isn't changing his? It sounds like you have a big enough file to stand behind your work; I'd wish you good luck in dealing with this, but I don't think you will need it...:triumph:


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 6:49 pm
Rich.
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lmbrls, post: 381562, member: 6823 wrote: Believe me. Those of us that are not in a Recording State would love to see this change. Hopefully, this would reduce the number of pin farms.

Recording or not.... I want NY to first start by making this a mandatory monumentation state. Everyone just does paper surveys and leaves nothing on the ground... it becomes a mess


 
Posted : July 18, 2016 7:03 pm