"National provider of Due Diligence" sends e-mail concerning an ALTA survey that is needed for a 12,000 Sq Ft Office building built in 1986 on 3/4 acre lot. Wanting to know if I can provide an ALTA w/ items 1-4, 7a, 8-11a, 13 & 14 for a flat fee of $1,350.00
I have not yet responded.
That email Might Gather A Lot Of Attention
while low the price quote is not outrageous. Your not in Cali are you?
Paul in PA
What's distressing about this is they are dictating the fee.
They know nothing about the intricacies about this subdivision and the boundaries. They don't realize that this should require a total of 12 hours field surveying, 2 hours research, 1.5 hours calculations, 6 hours cad, all the associated admin. - the minimum fee should be near the $2,500 mark.
They are asking me to do this for a 45% discount.
Where's the profit? There isn't any.
As a matter of fact, you are paying them to do the work.
Any Jackleg who does work for 1/2 the fee will be taking shortcuts, let alone not getting paid for 6 months. These brokers are a pox in our profession and surveyors who work for them are nothing more than prostitutes.
It would be in violation of BOL rules in Alabama to accept that job. While unrealistic, we are not allowed to compete for work by price, mainly for what 6th PM said above.
Actually I think they left off a zero
$199.93
This week only. Lock in your acceptance by 8:56 a.m. or lose this great opportunity to have us provide the service you requested. We should have this completed by March 2012.
Here's the property
> What's distressing about this is they are dictating the fee.
Evidently the client has a bid in hand but would prefer to use 6th PM. At least he is giving him a chance rather than just selecting the low bidder.
I don't have a problem with this conceptually. Client says "I'm willing to pay $1350 for this job. Who's willing to do it for that?". At least here you know were the bottom is from the start.
> They know nothing about the intricacies about this subdivision and the boundaries. They don't realize that this should require a total of 12 hours field surveying, 2 hours research, 1.5 hours calculations, 6 hours cad, all the associated admin. - the minimum fee should be near the $2,500 mark.
I pretty much agree with your estimate. My last job, the policy was no ALTA's under $3,000. Just not worth the hassle for less.
> They are asking me to do this for a 45% discount.
That's today's economy.
> Where's the profit? There isn't any.
Profit!!!?? In 2010!!?? ROTFLMAO
> Any Jackleg who does work for 1/2 the fee will be taking shortcuts, let alone not getting paid for 6 months. These brokers are a pox in our profession and surveyors who work for them are nothing more than prostitutes.
In normal times I'd agree. But in 2010 this is market rate. Just because someone is doing work for a price that would be out of the question in normal times it doesn't make him a "jackleg". It makes him someone trying to survive.
> Here's the property
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?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
Maybe he's contracting to a crew for half the money.
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> In normal times I'd agree. But in 2010 this is market rate. Just because someone is doing work for a price that would be out of the question in normal times it doesn't make him a "jackleg". It makes him someone trying to survive.
Paying someone else to allow you to do their work for them is not "survival". It's stupidity. As long as people are willing to do stuff like that, things won't change.
If there are one-man operations out there, running out of their houses with no E&O insurance, who can actually afford to do stuff like this and make a profit, well then, it's probably not a sign of 2010. It's a sign of the future.
If that's what's going to happen, then watch the "mortgage market" become NOTHING BUT these survey brokers. Survey firms like ours will no longer do ALTA surveys, period, and they can get what they pay for.
this whole broker thing stinks
the broker is probably charging the client $10,000 and finding some sucka surveyor to do this for nothing, and loosing money doing it while taking short cuts and taking on all the liability so that some broker can pocket $8,500
Yep, in deed, tough times we are in.
Tough being a surveyor.
Hell, why don't I take the job and find some surveyor that's down on his luck to do it for $500, while I then pocket $800 and pass the plat on to Mr. Broker
I would simply ask him "If you are paying $1,300 then who is paying the rest of the invoice?"
It has always been the case around here. From time to time, it seems that everyone begins to ask for prices and will call every survey they can for best price and fastest turn around. That is fine, I do not have a problem with people shopping.
Some claim that they really would prefer that you do the job because of the quality of work, yet they have set a limit on what they will spend for s survey. The amount of which is near one months loan payment.
My problem is with the clients that tell me what I am going to be paid for what should cost twice or more as much as they quote. A number that has been put in their head by a realtor or banker or another unqualified party.
It is cheaper to sit at home than to pay to survey out clients land.
Nobody else in the group of people involved in a property transaction is lowering their fees. Their fees are set in stone as they would put it and everyone of them is quaranteed to be paid over and over at the same rate for one of our surveys. We are the only ones that are liable for our one survey for 10yrs down the road (Texas) and have no real ideal who is on the list of persons that will be using our survey during that time.
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> It has always been the case around here. From time to time, it seems that everyone begins to ask for prices and will call every survey they can for best price and fastest turn around. That is fine, I do not have a problem with people shopping.
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Well then you have it
That's the difference between a trade and a profession
Not all professionals charge the same fees.
Realtors have a standard fee of 6% plus anything over the agreed price.
Title companies fees are set by the state.
Lenders charge interest based on prime plus x percent plus points based on a persons credit ratings
It is illegal for surveyors to gather and set fees.
Our fees are negotiable to a certain extent but not to be dictated upon.
Shopping is only a term I used that described what clients do by calling around and asking for prices, maybe there is a better term......
$13,500 and we can start to talk on the ALTA. Item 1 being about $2500 alone since I'd have to file a Record of Survey with the county.
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> Shopping is only a term I used that described what clients do by calling around and asking for prices, maybe there is a better term......
There is - "Dutch Auction"
That type of email is frowned upon by the Texas Board. And most other boards I deal with don't like it either.:-P
For an ALTA/Category 1A(Texas) I would have said $2800 30 years ago. We used to estimate those at $350 per building and I counted 8 buildings. $1,350:bad:
I received 2 today from the same guy. Had to hit delete twice.
This is really simple. Send him this email:
Dear Broker;
NO.
Thank you,
The Surveyor
