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Definition of Daylight on Plan

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field-dog
(@field-dog)
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What does daylight mean on the attached paving and drainage plan?

  1. IMG 1594
 
Posted : November 22, 2024 6:31 am
MightyMoe
(@mightymoe)
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Constructed slope meets original ground. 

 
Posted : November 22, 2024 6:47 am
4
holy-cow
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Agree with Moe

 
Posted : November 22, 2024 11:16 am
squirl
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Posted by: @mightymoe

Constructed slope meets original ground. 

+1

 

T. Nelson - SAM

 
Posted : November 22, 2024 11:33 am
jitterboogie
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In the special space of IANAL, I would personally ask the EOR what the term Daylight is defined by and get it in writing, so there is no scintilla of difference than the intended and defined meaning.  it’s that important to know what the intent was because who wants to make another lawyer more money because of a simple discrepancy of a word and its connotation.  Sorry, I’m all hyper vigilant because I’m studying for the PS and getting my head wrapped around all the other ridiculous and obtuse questions I’ve been exposed to in the review process..... 😫 😪 😝 

 
Posted : November 22, 2024 12:27 pm

field-dog
(@field-dog)
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@jitterboogie 

I've attached a better scan of the plan showing the offending terminology.

Paving and Drainage Plan

 

 
Posted : November 24, 2024 11:22 am
MightyMoe
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Still going with the above definition.

Think of it like this: you place a storm pipe in the ground to collect rainwater and move it to a stream with a steep bank. Where the pipe breaks out of the ground on the slope of the stream bank is where it daylights. In that case it's exposed to the light. It's pushed through the ground until it meets the existing slope. 

They are wanting the drainage ditch to be re-sloped at .28% for 200 feet until it meets existing ground, or daylights.  

 
Posted : November 24, 2024 3:24 pm
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GaryG
(@gary_g)
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I guess my question is do you:

Regrade the ditch at 0.28% for 200ft

Regrade the ditch at 0.28% until it intersects the 97 elev.

 

 
Posted : November 24, 2024 3:41 pm
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lurker
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@gary_g Exactly. they can't have it both ways unless it is a perfect world. There is a hinge point in the ditch which is probably a solid structure with a defined invert. You can either grade from there to daylight at 0.28% or you can find the 97' elevation where they want it to daylight and grade back to the hinge point. I think they want it to daylight at 97' elevation and have a minimum grade of 0.28%. If existing conditions wouldn't let me meet those requirements, I would ask the engineer how he wants to change the plan. Or maybe it is the opposite and grade at 0.28% until daylight is found. But you can never call for all three items on the plan, distance, percent, and daylight. Only 2 of the three can be accomplished.

 
Posted : November 24, 2024 9:06 pm
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MightyMoe
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0.28% is awfully flat for these parts.

I will assume the plans come from some flatland area. If it were me I would use that number as a minimum and if the 200' or 97' El works to 0.4% I'd run with it, but if it comes out less than 0.28% I'd adjust something.

Plans like that need some field design, the numbers are suggestions. Less than 0.28% and you're making a wetland. 

 
Posted : November 25, 2024 7:56 am

GaryG
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Invert 97.63'-(0.0028*200)=97.07' So it is close. 

 

 
Posted : November 26, 2024 6:59 am
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jitterboogie
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@gary_g 

Invert dips within a 0.1' across a structure are what we're told to look for in the field, so 0.07 seems well in that ball park. I think the "Daylight" part is the issue im having.... an 18" RCP daylighting is about 1.71' higher in elevation that the daylighting of the invert.  Thats all I was trying to convey, what is the intended meaning of daylight, because its not a standard defined temr, connotation is everything in font of the judge....Surveyors shouldn't have to guess, Engineers need to learn to communicate better, Kumbaya....bla bla bla... 😎 

 
Posted : November 26, 2024 6:57 pm
BStrand
(@bstrand)
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Contractor doesn't want to move anymore dirt than they have to so be sure to hit that 0.28% right on.  😛 

 
Posted : December 2, 2024 4:24 pm