Education Requirements - IL

Nonsense like this isn't helpful to justifying the board's continued existance.

Not much you can do about it except take the class. I'm licensed in Illinois but I got mine before the education requirement kicked in. I don't think they would let me sit for the test now even though I have a BS degree. I don't think I meet the math requirements.

well, that stinks.. can you take an online course?? at least you wouldn't have the hassle of getting to a campus. When I was starting surveying in Illinois, they had started the degree requirement, but had no in state college that offered an actual survey program. go figure.

Andy J, post: 380852, member: 44 wrote: well, that stinks.. can you take an online course?? at least you wouldn't have the hassle of getting to a campus. When I was starting surveying in Illinois, they had started the degree requirement, but had no in state college that offered an actual survey program. go figure.

Most online courses are only 3 hours and they are requiring 4. I enrolled in a summer course at a local junior college but between work and life I just didn't have the time for the course.

I can understand that IL might have wanted me to take courses specific to surveying in IL (Missouri required I take their Legal Aspects course) but I can't see how physics will make me a better surveyor.

And, IL still does not have a degree in surveying in their state that I am aware of. There are specializations available at SIUE and SIUE but not a true surveying degree.

yes, that special Illinois based physics will make a huge impact on your survey life.

Rules are the rules

headywest, post: 380855, member: 9223 wrote:
I can understand that IL might have wanted me to take courses specific to surveying in IL (Missouri required I take their Legal Aspects course) but I can't see how physics will make me a better

Except for boundaries, surveying is applied physics, so I understand the requirement, but I can't see how you couldn't have the equivalent of the 8 hours with a BS in forestry. Did you take any soil science classes?

Gteat Basin College has an online 4 credit introductory physics class.

I was checking the IL requirements and saw 24 surveying credits required, but not other specific disciplines.

It is hard to understand having 194 college credits and only an inkling of chemistry and physics. Hard, but not impossible. I have 142 credits from Lehigh University, 6 being surveying, 6 surveying credits from County College of Morris and 30 from NJIT. Including other courses, I have 197 college credits, but have never taken a Statistics course. I would need that for an NJIT degree in surveying.

Please explain in more detail what you have and under what criteria you are applying to IL. I know PA has at least 6 sets of criteria, and the sum total gets confusing.

Eight chemistry/physics credits sounds more like an engineering requirement.

Paul in PA

Had my situation in surveying depend upon an education in chemistry, I would still be a brush ape.
Physics on the other hand makes perfect sense.
The fact that you are licensed in two states should be enough qualification to allow you to at least be able to sit for the test.
good luck

headywest, post: 380816, member: 9223 wrote: I am seeking licensing in IL. The IL Board has denied my application based on my being 4 hours short of the 8 hours of required Basic Sciences (Chemistry and/or Physics). I only have 4 hours of Chemistry.

I have a bachelor of science in forestry, a master of science in geography and 11 years experience as a surveyor. I am licensed in Missouri and in Texas.

I submitted all 194+/- credit hours to the Board and asked that they consider that I indirectly covered the required 4 hours which they denied. The rules say "or their equivalent" so my second appeal provided 9 hours in which chemistry was a prerequisite. Denied.

Has anyone else run into this with the IL Board? What was your resolution?

The Board basically told me to go back and take a 100 level Physics or Chemistry course for the required 4 hours.

Thanks in advance!

I applied and had the exact same result. I also have nearly the exact same education. After 3 letters back and forth, I have to take 7 hours additional math and 3 hrs Chemistry.

I think I understand what is happening in Illinois. The Board must be controlled by Professional Engineers who have followed the stories told by contributors to this forum and its predecessors. They have discovered that some "sissy" States allow those with little formal education to sit for the examination. They have read stories by those who majored in bartending, dishwashing, dope smoking and living in Mama's basement until age 42. They don't want to encourage the mouthy ones who proclaim equality with those who have not only met the minimum requirements but surpassed them by far. They take the "engineer bashing" seriously. The sins of others come home to roost on those who have even the most minor of deficiencies. Blame your peers, not your superiors..
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(Donning flame retardant suit and turning off the computer now.)

In order to survey in the Chicagoland area, you have to have chemistry. There is no other way. They do not want anybody that does not have a rudimentary understanding of chemistry! With all the drugs, and salt on the roads, and the multiculturalism that is so dominant. With fireworks in the city, mixed with gun powder, and such.....

Headywest,

Check out Northern Illinois University's Geography/Geomatics program. Compare their overall requirements against what you already have. Use that program as the next basis of appeal. Since much is online, it may be ideal if you in fact have to take a course. If you do not have a course in statistics, it might be worthwhile to propose that as a substitute.

Per NIU, "The curriculum in Geomatics includes 24 hours of course work in surveying. Together with other required courses and electives, the program meets State of Illinois requirements for taking the surveyor in-training examination and pursuing a career as a licensed professional land surveyor."

http://www.geomatics.niu.edu/geog/undergraduatestudies/geomatics.shtml

Southern Illinois University Civil Engineering appears to have dropped their surveying courses, retaining only 1 basic course.

http://engineering.siu.edu/civil/undergraduate/undergraduate-courses.php

Paul in PA

There is also Purdue University Northwest. They have a Construction Engineering & Management Technology degree with the land surveying option that is accepted by Illinois.

http://academics.pnw.edu/construction-science-organizational-leadership/csol-home/cmet-degree/

The school did have several distance learning courses and you may be able to take their 4 credit hour physics course if offered.

SURVEYLTD, post: 380857, member: 319 wrote: Rules are the rules

Where did you receive your chemistry and physics credits?

Robert Hill, post: 380938, member: 378 wrote: Where did you receive your chemistry and physics credits?

Gradute of U of Notre Dame 74.

As far as I know, there has always been a school in Illinois that offered the required classes in surveying. At first it was SIUC. The program died when the main teacher, Roy Frank left. They do offer the classes at SIUE now and NIU now. Parkland College also offers a strong program but I don't know if they offer all the required surveying classes or not. Its also my understanding that a lot of the surveying classes are taught by local surveyors and not a full time proffesor, but I'm not sure of this. Usually you end up with a degree that is not in surveying but some kind of engineering degree with an emphasis on geomatics.

As far as the board, I'm not all that familar with the members but the list I last saw made me feel it was surveyors and not a bunch of engineers. They have the surveying credit hours requirement but then they also list a certain number of hours of other classes they require, such as sciences, math etc. I don't think it matters what your degree is in, as long as you meet the requirements. Its also my understanding they are pretty strong on enforcing those requriements as people are finding out. It can seem silly but they don't make exceptions.

They just want to make sure you dont mix Acid and Bases when setting a property corner, and that you are drinking H₂O and not H₂O_2.