Calculating quotes

Both.
If a job actually takes 1 day, but would take 3, except you already had some of it solved, there is nothing wrong with flat charging what it is worth.

I prefer to work under the color of "not to exceed" prices. And I always shoot high so the client is not disappointed. Actual invoicing may or may not include any hourly fees, but I always justify what the client has been charged.

Hourly work (like really ugly mile long hacking our way through cross timbers) is billed as hourly...with the understanding nobody gets in any hurry. 😉

George Washington was once asked to justify his $100 invoice for surveying a large tract of land. He responded, "$5 for materials (pipes) - $95 for knowing where to set said pipes."

Depends on the Length of job and what would be required. I base everything on a hourly rate for crew (2 surveyors) and then adjust that for a daily rate depending on distance etc....you just have to get a feel about how much profit you want to make and still keeping your guys busy.

Gee sometimes the Clients tell me how much their lawyer told them a survey that they needed cost . When I quote a realistic price they argue or hang up.

Bill Etzkorn, post: 376610, member: 11808 wrote: Gee sometimes the Clients tell me how much their lawyer told them a survey that they needed cost . When I quote a realistic price they argue or hang up.

When I laugh they hang up...
I ask them why the lawyer (realtor..etc) isn't doing IT for that price...errr...uhhhh...wellll...

DDSM

I just feel out the going rate at the time. I don't do hourly. I have xxx amount for a regular size survey. Then add as it gets bigger. Also depending if I already have control right near the lot I take into consideration.

Then I Google Earth street view it and see how the property looks to see if it's gonna be a pain in the butt. If so I add another 100 or 200 depending.

Each job type kinda has a starting price.

Also depending if I want the job or not. If it's a job I don't really wanna have to do I add 30-40% on top to make it more worth the effort if they were to bite.

I do not bid.

I offer my services for a ballpark figure that is based on time that I choose to bill. How I calculate the total bill is my business, not that of the client. Any client who thinks they are going to tell me how to bill, will not become my client. Plain and simple. I run the business, they do not.

My time is all I can offer someone else. What they get for each minute of that time is what matters. Someone else may complete a job in X hours but I put in 2X or I put in 1/2 X. Slaves to a published rate backed up with time clock proof are suckers.

The end product is either worth it to the client or it's not. Many times they view any expense as excessive because they are being forced by outside influences to have it done. An example being the elevation certificate that the lender demands be provided prior to approving the loan requested by the client. Any rate is too high, as is the total invoice. On the other hand, the client who needs help in achieving a complicated goal with which they have very limited, if any, personal skill seeks out the individual who can do the job in such a way that they feel they have received what they need. Being a respected professional is what brings the latter type of client to you. And, those clients will proudly mention you as being important in their success which, in turn, fosters your own success. You want to become that go-to resource for the long term stability of your business. You may still need to take on many of those little projects where the client hates your bill, but just remember, "If it was easy, no one would pay me to do it."

All my contracts require me to submit "lump sum" contracts. In production housing that is the only way proposals are accepted so as to distribute the price "across the board" for each house to be constructed.There are ALWAYS additional items a builder needs such as elevation certificates, recreation areas staked, as-builts on retention ponds etc. This is usually icing on the cake. For these items we charge $295/hr. 2 man crew, $195/hr PLS but this includes office work as well. I don't charge seperately for drafting, cadd tech, administrative etc., it's built in to the aforementioned prices. I love it when half of a 600 unit subdivision is in a flood zone. Usually after one elev. cert. the rest contain the same information so it's just a matter of changing the finished floor elevaion and changing photos for each certificate. Kinda like "easter eggs" in the contract. 😉

I give fixed fee proposals on 95% of my work. I set the fee on what it's worth, to me, to do the project. You either agree that it's worth the fee, or not. I arrive at my fee by factoring in estimated time, current work load, interest of project, and potential problems, including the PITA factor.

Dtp

I prefer lump sum contracts, and I calculate that fee based upon $150 an hour no matter what I'm doing. However, I also look at the client, and the project, and how I feel about them, and bump it up or down depending. My clients are fairly sophisticated and have a good idea of what things cost.

I never charge for materials, gas, meals, or anything like that.

ps Never give a client the impression you are sticking it to them. They don't like it.

Bruce Small, post: 378426, member: 1201 wrote: I prefer lump sum contracts, and I calculate that fee based upon $150 an hour no matter what I'm doing. However, I also look at the client, and the project, and how I feel about them, and bump it up or down depending. My clients are fairly sophisticated and have a good idea of what things cost.

I never charge for materials, gas, meals, or anything like that.

ps Never give a client the impression you are sticking it to them. They don't like it.

Bruce,

You must have dropped your fees, if I remember right on the old board you said you averaged $250 per hour.
I have been trying to live up to your previous standards, but have not made it there.

The $250 an hour was when projects and money were coming in by the wheelbarrow full, I had the very latest equipment, and I was much younger (I have aged considerably in the past few years, and it is astonishing how fast that happens). I just can't work at the pace I once did, when I was one of the fastest walkers around, and always thinking five shots ahead. To be honest, and I always try to be realistic, I'm no longer worth $250 an hour. I am certainly worth $150, so I go with that.

I truly know what a boundary will cost when I add it upon completion. A Boundary Survey is not a widget. A "will not exceed (price) without prior authorization" works well. As HC stated, the client that benefits from your survey and appreciates your work is the best client you can get.

Bruce Small, post: 378434, member: 1201 wrote: The $250 an hour was when projects and money were coming in by the wheelbarrow full, I had the very latest equipment, and I was much younger (I have aged considerably in the past few years, and it is astonishing how fast that happens). I just can't work at the pace I once did, when I was one of the fastest walkers around, and always thinking five shots ahead. To be honest, and I always try to be realistic, I'm no longer worth $250 an hour. I am certainly worth $150, so I go with that.

I am glad to see that you are still at it, I am not too many years behind you.

Ed

I don't like not to exceed costs. They only give you the option of losing money. I prefer fixed whenever possible and have recently added a statement that if major boundary problems are encountered, additional work may be required. This operates the opposite of a not to exceed.

Bruce Small, post: 378434, member: 1201 wrote: The $250 an hour was when projects and money were coming in by the wheelbarrow full, I had the very latest equipment, and I was much younger (I have aged considerably in the past few years, and it is astonishing how fast that happens). I just can't work at the pace I once did, when I was one of the fastest walkers around, and always thinking five shots ahead. To be honest, and I always try to be realistic, I'm no longer worth $250 an hour. I am certainly worth $150, so I go with that.

Bruce - with your level of experience I'd think you were worth $350/hr. You should be getting more valuable over time, not less!

Jim in AZ, post: 378465, member: 249 wrote: Bruce - with your level of experience I'd think you were worth $350/hr. You should be getting more valuable over time, not less!

Wait until you get old like me, then you'll understand. The mind is willing but the body is weak. It just ain't there no more. I still love surveying, though. It's still fun to go out and play in the dirt and solve mysteries. Last week a commercial owner told me he had looked for a corner monument for years and never found it. I swept the various blossoms off the sidewalk with my foot and there was the lead cap in the concrete walk, where it had been for at least 60 years. He was just looking in the wrong place. That made my day.

Bruce Small, post: 378434, member: 1201 wrote: The $250 an hour was when projects and money were coming in by the wheelbarrow full, I had the very latest equipment, and I was much younger (I have aged considerably in the past few years, and it is astonishing how fast that happens). I just can't work at the pace I once did, when I was one of the fastest walkers around, and always thinking five shots ahead. To be honest, and I always try to be realistic, I'm no longer worth $250 an hour. I am certainly worth $150, so I go with that.

Gidday Bruce, Can certainly relate ! Agree about how time flies. Here in SOZ many displaced junior jocks set up and charging 1990 prices ebven though gear trbled in price and real estate value times minimum of 5 since then.

My my good value adding clients either fallen off perch, retired or gone terribly slow because we are still in recession.

So those forced to get survey just use me to bounce a second fee.......

RADU