Be careful what you call it

OMG, I heard about this, we all chuckled about it at the office, but.........:-(

The key event of this century is the demographic explosion of idiotic ideas.
-Nicolás Gómez Dávila

> The key event of this century is the demographic explosion of idiotic ideas.

I suppose idiotic ideas have flourished recently, but I would probably tend to believe idiotic ideas have really always been with us. What has exploded possibly is the insane propagation and embracement of those idiotic ideas.

Folks clinging to and vehemently defending lunacy is a modern phenomenon. Why else would there be so many attorneys?

... and now I get to pay a portion of this $1.6 million.

Steve

Yep. Utter nonsense. I can't believe that they settled that case, now you will see other cases against other retails in other states causing more time and money to be wasted. I really hate lawyers.

They should have had to pay treble damages for any actual harm that was proven, and no more.

How many significant digits are needed to avoid liability? $o if a surveyor shows 121.39 feet on the plat and it can be proven that it was only 121.38 is he liable? If Lowe's had 1.51" X 3.51" 2X4s would they have been found liable? Maybe they need a sign "No warranty is expressed or implied for the dimensions of any lumber. Dimension at your own risk".

Slippery slope arguments don't work well in the legal world.

The retailer clearly labeled a product with a dimension that it isn't. Cry and moan all you want but that is what happened. They aren't getting into di minimus amounts.

I see this a lot in the real property business. Realtors market some parcel as a "5 acre parcel." First, the Deed states no quantity and second, when you multiply the length by the width given in the Deed (without even surveying it) it is 4.81 acres but still the property owner insists he bought "5 acres." I think it should be required to be made clear that 5 acres is not always 5 acres.

Finally, this is very old news, came out last year.

The fact that common sense does not work well in the legal world is the point I am making. 2" X 4" at 1-1/2" X 3-1/2" has been the industry standard for at least 50 years of which I am aware. Who was harmed by this? This is ridiculous litigation.

I agree 100%. There is no such thing as common sense, common courtesy, or common decency any more. There are far too many people that cannot take responsibility for their own actions, or are so one sided in their thinking that it astounds me. It is becoming an all about me society that we live in.

> Whoever says that he "belongs to his time" is only saying that he agrees with the largest number of fools at that moment.

True; LOL

> I really hate lawyers.

Actually, I hold the general populace responsible. We the people sit on the juries. If we don't affirm them then they will go somewhere else to peddle their wares.

Steve

> Who was harmed by this?

Idiot homeowners doing their own work and forgetting rule # 1 in carpentry:

Measure Twice, Cut Once

Let that idiot homeowner frame up a wall with roughcut 2x4's (real 4 inches) and then try to find a door frame that will fit and see who starts whining.

James

What they don't mention is that we are still paying for the boardfeet of an actual 2x4

Shame on you all, Re: Be careful what you call it

Edit, the title of this thread should have been: "Be careful of what you read".

Every one of you have fallen into the trap of today's all-too-common yellow journalism. Maybe that's the fault of you-all's spending too much time watching Keeping up with the Kardashians and beginning to believe everyting you see and read is real?

The case of "People of the State of California v Lowes Home Centers LLC" was never about regular lumber 2x4's nominal vs actual dimensions. This case was about Lowes selling composite structural products which were labeled at smaller dimensions than actual.

BIG DIFFERENCE. True facts of the case are that the complaint was initiated by the Weights and Standards folks who found that Lowes was misrepresenting the sizes of structural items made of composite materials. The settlement ruling is clear that this case is not about standard lumber nominal dimensions vs actual dimensions.

Everyone of you relied on ignorant and/or deceptive practices of the journalists who wanted to sell magazines and newspapers and their sole reliance on the not-too-forthright announcements from the spokespersons for Lowes.

Here's a truthful look at the issue:

http://www.sbcmag.info/news/2014/sep/district-attorney-lowes-case-dont-fret-using-2x4

And here is the actual case ruling/settlement:

http://cdnassets.hw.net/8f/fa/17292adc448980b6eab02fa96fcb/lowes-2x4-final-judgement.pdf

I would hope that surveyors, of whom's primary responsibility are as impartial investigators of fact, would do a better job of staying off the wrong bandwagon.

Speaking of standard wood lumber, the real crime today is that log buyers are still paying timber owners on Scribner Scale, instead of a representation of the quantity of lumber in a tree that is actually produced by today's mills. Today, log sellers are shortchanged 50% and higher on lumber content of many species of logs sold to mills.

> What they don't mention is that we are still paying for the boardfeet of an actual 2x4

At retail you generally pay by the lineal foot, not board foot.

And something to consider, how big do you think the piece of wood is before it is dried and planed down to a kiln-dried, surfaced 4 side dimension? The answer is, it depends.

For example, a knotty white fir 2x12 may need to start out at 2-1/16 x 12-3/8 before it is dried and surfaced to a 1-1/2 x 11-1/2 board.

It all depends on the species, the clearness of grain, and the saw and planer, but typically, the rough, green dimension is close to or even larger than the nominal dimension it is advertised as.

Some of the wood you buy is lost to saw kerf, planer shavings, and moisture content shrinkage.

Shame on you all, Re: Be careful what you call it

Point well made

Shame on you all, Re: Be careful what you call it

edit to my original posting, I meant to say Lowes was selling composite structural members labeled as being LARGER than their actual dimension.