Got a call today, builder/owner has a Building/Grading/Septic Design Plan but needs an Elevation Certificate before bank lends him the money to build a home for his son?
I ask, why he does not get the Engineer/Surveyor who did said plan to do it?
He is too busy.
Knowing I will never get enough information over the phone I ask if I can see the site as well as said plan. I grab the township subdivision and zoning ordinance as well as county planning commission stream watershed study. Scale off Lat and Lon and do radial search for benchmarks. Print out closest 3 hits.
Meet a different son at site after lunch. Proceed to scan plan and site. Tell son I will have to get back to them with an estimate.
OK, This is what I have, "Grading Plan/Septic Design" sheet 1 of 2, I do not need the septic details.
Bearings and distances on Plan, no monuments shown, confirmed by me no monuments seen in field.
"Project Benchmark" is assumed elevation on a culvert invert.
Partial site topo to stream bank, about 1/4 of lot. North lot line crosses stream, south lot corner in stream.
Plan shows a 50' streamside easement from top of bank for South half of lot only.
Plan shows 100 Year Floodplain line splitting lot 50/50. No elevation on said line.
Edge of gravel infiltration bed for septic system is 50.4' from top of bank. (Minimum in PA is 50')
Fill is required for septic system berm within the Floodplain, with following note"
"The proposed construction of the septic system berm will not raise the elevation of the 100 year flood by more than one (1) foot." No refernce to an engineer doing "Net Fill" calculations.
Plan shows dedication of 13.5' additional right of way. No lot areas provided what so ever.
No reference on plan to an existing survey or reference to an existing deed.
In area of the proposed driveway is a posted notice for a recent zoning board meeting regarding this lot. With the number right in front of me I call the zoning officer. He confirms no survey was submitted separately and walks me through what the township required. As far as they are concerned this can be built.
I wander around the township for the balance of the afternoon and recover 2 of the monuments I have data sheets for, about 2 miles from project. The stream study map I have is on a reduced USGS background. I then proceed to work my way back toward the project and recover 3 more monuments, the first PennDOT with no reference number, the next 2 USGS vertical control. Both within 1/2 mile of project. I download the data sheets but have no clue why they did not come up in my earlier radial search.
So this is what I know. I would have to go to county planning office tomorrow to review the FIRM map. My stream report says my project area has a Preliminary Mapping, not a Detailed Flood Study.
The 100 year stream flow passing my site is 3,364.9 cubic feet per second.
I am thinking:
Cannot do an Elevation Certificate without a flood elevation or a structure.
Cannot do a LOMA for a vacant lot since 1/2 of lot is within floodplain.
There is 700 linear feet of stream on the parcel, cross sections must exceed 300 feet in width.
Need a lot survey, Tax Map says 3.7 Ac, adjacent parcels are 4.1, 9.5 and 31 Ac.
Topo Cross Section about 10 acres.
HEC analysis, confirming an elevation.
Maybe adjust proposed elevations.
Do I need as a minimum an actual basement to start a LOMA on a structure?
Did I mention he was thinking next week.
Paul in PA
If you can define the portion of the lot above the BFE by metes and bounds, you can begin a LOMA for that area. Your client may have to get you to provide the bank with an as-built of improvements.
You can also begin the process with a proposed location through FEMA. You can get a preliminary removal based on the proposed house plans. This will need to have a follow-up visit with additional submissions for the final LOMA determination
Agreed, you can do a metes and bounds of the area they want removed. Also, Line C1 of the Elev Cert asks if building elevations are based on "Construction drawings", "Building under construction", etc. You don't need a standing structure. If FILL is being placed or has been placed in the area to be removed, that will complicate things substantially.
Paul:
You should be able to see the current maps at the online FEMA Map Store.
Any BFE's or has there been a study done on the creek?
If the maps are being revised or modernized, there's probably a state agency involved. In Illinois it's the State Water Survey
Pennsylvania is part of the USGS Streamstats program. You should be able to get initial Q values of your stream from there.
A quick explanation of the LOMA vs. LOMR, or the LOMR-F:
LOMAS pertain to mapping inaccuracies due to impropoer interpolation of contours, etc.
LOMR's and LOMR-F's pertain to structural changes such as fill.
Make sure you're dealing with the right critter.
Good Luck,
Marc
The Particular Maps I Need Have Not Been Digitized Yet
Checked last night, did not yet research if they are available online in another format. I am heading to the Planning Commission to review the full report.
Correction, it is closed for Veterans Day.
Potential client informed me, "Oh yes I do have a survey from a prior surveyor" and he aware of an actual timeline.
This is a lot of time for an estimate, but you have to work hard to even get hard work these days.
Marc, thanks for the link to the FEMA contacts.
Paul in PA
"I ask, why he does not get the Engineer/Surveyor who did said plan to do it?
He is too busy."
Oh Boy!
That's your first clue.
Don't let them push you too much. They want to build next to a flood plain and aquire a mortgage so they will just have to wait. Do what you can to speed things up-but NEXT WEEK?
I've had the same problem with the radial search function for data sheets.
Put in an area and nothing comes up; go to the field and find bench marks, put in the bench mark name there they are.
And yes, I checked the area a number of times and the marks just don't show.
sounds like John Payne has the bases covered.
I really dislike being brought into the ' tail end' of a project. I am usually very hesitant because the client thinks it will be a quick and easy. I find it is the other way. You must re-establish or provide the missing work from before and they do not understand .
We have something called Culvert Verification Report here that is required for the Parish. It is for d/w culvert installation.
I will do them when I am the surveyor from the get-go.
also, it seems that if you know someone, the Parish will do the survey for you under the Parish engineer. But if you don't, then you must provide from a private surveyor.
But when people call and say that is all they need for their occupancy permit, I tend to shy away from them.
When I give them my price, they tend to shy away from me.
🙂