I'm doing a survey next week on a rural parcel for some out of state folks who just purchased this land and want to fence it and have a getaway place for their RV & associated dogs & horses.
I pull the deed and it lists the appropriate legal description, followed by the Tax ID number.
I thought recorders and attornies were smarter than that. Guess not.
There is a deed in Maryland where a decent sized development company changed names and transferred every property that they owned to the new company using a deed that listed all of the properties by tax id number alone. I think it was somewhere around 100 properties. I just looked it up, it is hundreds of properties.:-P
It was a nightmare!
It is common to see AP numbers on the Deed form (there is a space for it) but they are informational only. The Assessor changes the numbers on a seeming whim so they are often not useful.
It can be handy if you are trying to figure out where a bunch of Deeds are located roughly. Obviously it's just a start; it doesn't have any legal effect.
I have been told by older Surveyors that it is absolutely sacrilege to see an AP number on a sacred text like a Deed but I don't think it's that big a deal as long as they aren't being used as the legal description.
One of the local counties here lists the tax parcel number on every deed.
> One of the local counties here lists the tax parcel number on every deed.
How can the county revise a valid deed by inserting anything to it? There job is to record public records. Period.
If it is included in the recording information stamp (typically upper right hand corner of the document), that's convienient and good for indexing, etc. OK. But if they insert it into the body of the deed, thats..... well I won't say fraud, but I'm sure there is another term.
The recorder makes you write the parcel id on deeds filed here in Macomb Co. MI.
> > One of the local counties here lists the tax parcel number on every deed.
>
> How can the county revise a valid deed by inserting anything to it? There job is to record public records. Period.
>
> If it is included in the recording information stamp (typically upper right hand corner of the document), that's convienient and good for indexing, etc. OK. But if they insert it into the body of the deed, thats..... well I won't say fraud, but I'm sure there is another term.
In Maryland the tax id is listed on the intake sheet attached to the end of the deed when it is recorded, here is the deed I mentioned before. Title search nightmare. You can also see the intake sheet. I have not seen any county add information to the body of the deed. I have seen lawyers edit a surveyors description.
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0BygQaOfk95VPOWkxODA3MVdUNWl1M0psUlpRRmNldw
Here the Title Company puts it on the Deeds; they handle the vast majority of transactions.
I did do a Survey for a client who had done his own transaction without benefit of a Title Company (no Title Insurance either) or a Real Estate firm but that's pretty rare.
Am assessment parcel number is a state requirement in Pennsylvania.
It only identifies the parcel.
Point being
A tax ID number is not a valid legal description. It is for indexing purposes only. They often change. No, they usually change.
A deed is the instrument of conveyance of real property, and contains the legal description of that property. By including the tax ID number in it, you place a potential for a discrepancy in future dealings with said property.
Ok if recorders want a special line item for it for their particular filing requirements, but when it's included within the legal description, it's just another hiccup to look at down the road.
...sorry having one of those anal days, especially after the Wings lost to those pesky Preds...;-)
With only a transposition in the Tax ID number, there could be
havoc created.
A tax assessment parcel number (lot and block) is also a state requirement in New Jersey on both the deed and the survey. It only identifies the parcel in a general sense, such as an address. After recording in the County Clerk's office a copy is forwarded on the the local Tax Assessor. It is then compared it to the current tax map, and the tax map is updated to reflect the current deed. It is also used to prevent illegal subdivisions.
> With only a transposition in the Tax ID number, there could be
> havoc created.
true. but also true about any other number in the deed.
I guess I don't see the big deal about putting an additional piece of information in the deed. I try not to complain when you coordinate guys insist on putting those in the deed.
And sure, tax ID numbers sometimes change but only every couple decades and the old numbers are kept for reference.
Point being
> A tax ID number is not a valid legal description. It is for indexing purposes only. They often change. No, they usually change.
>
> A deed is the instrument of conveyance of real property, and contains the legal description of that property. By including the tax ID number in it, you place a potential for a discrepancy in future dealings with said property.
>
> Ok if recorders want a special line item for it for their particular filing requirements, but when it's included within the legal description, it's just another hiccup to look at down the road.
>
> ...sorry having one of those anal days, especially after the Wings lost to those pesky Preds...;-)
Sorry about the dead-wings, ...er ....I mean Red Wings 😉
I've performed quite a few surveys in which either the subject parcel and/or some of the adjoiners descriptions were nothing but a tax ID number. No biggie, just another latent ambiquity that was resolved by doing a little research. The parcel was uniquely identified, and I was able to find the boundaries on the ground. Just part of the job.
Tax Map #'s and PID's are now normal in the header or footer somehow in all the counties that I work in as additional information.
Escheat or tax sale properties are usually ONLY referred to by their tax map # (and maybe the prior owner) here in VA. That's how they know that taxes haven't been paid in a while. It's been that way since the 70's and maybe the 60's.
Carl
> > > One of the local counties here lists the tax parcel number on every deed.
> >
> > How can the county revise a valid deed by inserting anything to it? There job is to record public records. Period.
> >
> > If it is included in the recording information stamp (typically upper right hand corner of the document), that's convienient and good for indexing, etc. OK. But if they insert it into the body of the deed, thats..... well I won't say fraud, but I'm sure there is another term.
>
> In Maryland the tax id is listed on the intake sheet attached to the end of the deed when it is recorded, here is the deed I mentioned before. Title search nightmare. You can also see the intake sheet. I have not seen any county add information to the body of the deed. I have seen lawyers edit a surveyors description.
>
>> https://docs.google.com/open?id=0BygQaOfk95VPOWkxODA3MVdUNWl1M0psUlpRRmNldwbr >
best of luck with that mess. makes me wonder what benefit/protection they are getting from changing their name
i have seen lawyers wanting edited descriptions, too. they base it on nothing but their opinions, and don't want to hear otherwise from us.
Northampton County, PA, You Pay To Have The Tax ID Verified
If the GIS Department did not check it, you cannot file the deed. However the system is still a Tax Map Sheet, Block, Lot system. In Berks and Monroe among others the P.I.N. (Property Identification Number) is on the State Plane coordinate system. It is alternating system of pairs of Easting and Northing values. Each Map is identified by the Easting and Northing of the lower left corners, the Blocks are the next subset of the SPC identifying the E/N of the lower left block corner, and the parcel numbers identify the centroid of the lot. Odd shaped lots can lead to ???. Tax blocks can cross street borders, but it simplifies finding it on a tax map or on an ortho image.
Paul in PA
