Client A orders a survey to be done, splitting out 11 ac. from 50 that we had previously done. Deal is done with no realtor just the 2 parties. Both meet in my office, agree to the bounds, and we go stake it. Survey is drawn, and delivered to client A to use to get their financing and get their dream home. Push comes to shove and they cannot get financing so deal falls through. Client A paid for the survey in advance, no questions asked. Client A calls about 2 weeks ago and is adamant that we not give out their survey (we don't w/out permission anyways) to anyone looking to purchase the property. So, now, just got a phone call from a realtor who has client B on the line who wants to buy the property and wants a survey (this is a cash deal, no banks). So, they want a copy of the survey to which I state I cannot give it to them b/c it's not mine to give. Client B contacts Client A and offers an amount for the survey of about 1/2 what client A paid. Client A says "no", I get another phone call back asking what to do. I know these folks are going to want the thing surveyed and they know what it cost. I do business in a small town, so word will get out if somebody thinks I'm price gouging. My thought is, even though said survey is only a month old, I would charge Client B the same as I did client A. What say you?
Price it according to how much it would cost to actually resurvey it. Then go out and re-flag all the corners.;-)
> Client A calls about 2 weeks ago and is adamant that we not give out their survey (we don't w/out permission anyways) to anyone looking to purchase the property.
Well, unless you have some contractual arrangement otherwise, does Client A own the map and written description you generated? I assume that what you in effect provided Client A was access to the information and an assurance of its correctness, not ownership or control of your records. Surveyors are, after all, in the business of selling reliable information, often about the same piece of real property.
Client A now doesn't own any interest in the land that you surveyed. That remains vested in the original owner, so I'd say that Client A doesn't have any exclusive right to any of the information beyond what you and Client A explicitly agreed under the terms of your agreement to provide services.
I think that unless you have some specific contractual agreement with Client A, all you need to do is revise the map so that it is obviously a different document and do whatever is reasonably necessary to verify that it remains a true and correct representation of your survey and charge for your services as you do for updates. I'd think a base fee and time and expenses would be quite reasonable.
> Client A orders a survey to be done, splitting out 11 ac. from 50 that we had previously done. Deal is done with no realtor just the 2 parties. Both meet in my office, agree to the bounds, and we go stake it. Survey is drawn, and delivered to client A to use to get their financing and get their dream home. Push comes to shove and they cannot get financing so deal falls through. Client A paid for the survey in advance, no questions asked. Client A calls about 2 weeks ago and is adamant that we not give out their survey (we don't w/out permission anyways) to anyone looking to purchase the property. So, now, just got a phone call from a realtor who has client B on the line who wants to buy the property and wants a survey (this is a cash deal, no banks). So, they want a copy of the survey to which I state I cannot give it to them b/c it's not mine to give. Client B contacts Client A and offers an amount for the survey of about 1/2 what client A paid. Client A says "no", I get another phone call back asking what to do. I know these folks are going to want the thing surveyed and they know what it cost. I do business in a small town, so word will get out if somebody thinks I'm price gouging. My thought is, even though said survey is only a month old, I would charge Client B the same as I did client A. What say you?
I would not discount any work performed simply because I'd already performed the work a day ago, let alone a month. You are being paid for your expertise as well as knowledge of the area. You were given a clear edict from Client A not to give out their product.
What if your buddy was Surveyor A and you were Surveyor B, Clients are respective, would you ask your buddy for the information for free? If Client B went to another surveyor, would they not have to pay full price for the survey, even though the new surveyor would more than likely find your rods set and move on?
New Client, new Job, new possibility to lose or make money.
Not sure of your zip code, but around here the first call for any land division of any kind is to zoning. They are your friends. Make sure it is legal, per regulations. Remember we don't make the rules, but we sure as heck better know them.
Sounds like the call never got made to check, the realtor (albiet not really there) dropped a seeming ball, and ....hmmmmmm Now you're seemingly hanging in the wind.
I'd tend to level with the owner, tell them they effed' up, and cut bait. Tuck and roll, as they say. Call zoning and CYA.
I would charge Client B the same as I did client A. What say you?
I wouldn't
Do a new survey for new client and charge accordingly. In the future make sure your contracts state that you own all your work product and that you license a copy to client for their use on the project.
I've had this happen a time or two. What we do is that we tell them is less than the original, but we are going to check everything. A surveyor friend of mine recently pointed me to a court case that said that the client who payed for it owns the survey. Just because they don't own the land doesn't mean they don't own the service you provided. That being said, make it different and charge accordingly. Let everyone know. You're going to pi$$ off someone in the mix, just make sure you can fade the heat on the parties upset.
You should quote the same price the paid by the previous client. The potential new client would get their survey very quickly. If they don't like your quote, they can hire someone else. You would not lose anything and won't have a former client that might cause trouble.
> What say you?
I say I'm glad I practice a mandatory recording state.
I would redo the survey plat, verify the fieldwork, and charge full price. Then I would split any profits above the actual time it took with the client A and explain to them they can take it or leave it. Either way, it's done.
James
Sorry,
No advice, more curiousity as I'm from a state where a land split requires a subdivision process. My curiosity is that it sounds like the buyer(s) are the ones ordering the surveys. Why isn't the survey being made for the current owner?
That was my first thought. Where is the primary in all this? A clause in the contract should stipulate all survey information is my property. Client is entitled to a copy.
When I survey property "A" is it fair that the adjoining, property "B", also benefits from that survey without compensating me or splitting the cost with property "A"?
Or if I survey the whole block for one client and 2 days later a neighbor wants his P/L's done. Do I use the same survey data to make the fit?
hmmmm.....??
(answer - yes I would, but field verify the new survey location/corners!).
Sit back, relax, and watch the money roll in.
Tell the realtor to have client B buy the survey from client A if he will sell, sounds like he already tried that but offered too little. Did he know how much client A had invested in the survey? If client A won't sell, then your estimate to do the survey for client B is $XXX, and I would make it the same amount that client A had to pay.
If you think A owns the survey than it seems you have a moral/professional obligation to them to not give it away to someone else. I think Steve has the fare approach.
Maybe with moderate discount.
If you own the work then do what you think is the right thing to do, not what the townspeople think.
Here, here.
>In the future make sure your contracts state that you own all your work product and that you license a copy to client for their use on the project.
:good:
My $0.00 (no license)
You need an updated title check, however that is done in your area. You need to make sure nobody moved a pin or built a new structure across the line.
The fact that you probably will find undisturbed pins and you have almost all of the history means that you have less work to do than the first time. Tell them that you had to recheck things and draw a new plat, and charge somewhere between the effort required and the original price.
“I do business in a small town, so word will get out if somebody thinks I'm price gouging. My thought is, even though said survey is only a month old, I would charge Client B the same as I did client A. What say you?”
In my world the first seven words answer the question. 🙂
Put it in the contract.
In all our contracts we make it clear we own the work product, not the person ordering the survey. Sure they get copies of it, but we own all the rights to it.
Put it in the contract.
You are on good terms with client A right?
Have you discussed this with them? Call them up and tell them that you have been contacted to survey the tract and that per their request you are not going to give them a copy of the survey you did for them but you will go resurvey it and make a new survey if need be. One way or another it is getting done. I see no reason why they wouldn't want to sell their survey. What good does it do them? Do they think if they don't sell that somehow the property won't be sold and they might have another chance at buying it?