I visited three PLSS corners today installed in 2008 to replace original stones. That's all fine, I already new about the stones and the brass/stainless steel will last and be recognized by the public as other than a pile of rocks. They are all county markers, but all county work is done by private surveyors (including me).
I know the young guys that did the work, they are from the city (out of town) but as far as I can tell good surveyors. But there is one thing, all three caps are marked Range 5 East and we are in Range 4 East. Also one quarter corner is for Sections 3 and 4 and marked 2 and 3.
So other than ribbing these fellows (city slickers lost in the country) next time I see them does it really matter? I'm filing corner records (and GPS coordinates) that go into the state database which includes photos. So I'll just note the errors and roll ahead and collect my dime for the day.
Should anything else be done? Would you re stamp the caps? I didn't even have my stamp set with me, didn't think I would need it. I suppose I could where I'm filing a corner record but have never really pondered it until today. I found one stamped wrong by the GLO a couple weeks ago (wrong range number). I probably got a few errors out there also.
IMO it doesn't matter. Anyone who can read the cap would know it was just a mistake.
Don
From my point of view, they need to be corrected.
There are always many things out there to confuse someone.
It may not be a surveyor who gets confused.
The surveyors that did the work should come back on their own time and fix it.
If they don't then anyone with a stamp set should stamp the correction.
What Quality Control?
Does the monument record show the actual stamping or the correct stamping?
> IMO it doesn't matter. Anyone who can read the cap would know it was just a mistake.
>
> Don
If it doesn't matter, then why put a cap on it at all?
I think it should be corrected.
I would notify the surveyor whose license is on the monuments and hope he corrects it, or gives you permission to restamp it next time you are in the area. I would not want to stamp another surveyors monument without permission
LR
I like Aliquot's Idea. It is a "Good'un".:-)
It doesn't really mean all that much because the position of the cap is what matters, but I would call them and ask if it would be OK to fix it (I'm sure they would be happy to have you do that). All it takes is about 20 seconds to overstamp the #s. I happen to know this from my own "typos" on caps. I've also seen GLO/BLM caps with the same issues and even a few stones that had more notches than they should have but I wouldn't throw them out because of that.
Seems to me like the PLS in responsible charge should be contacted and AT LEAST made aware of the mis-stamped caps. If they were MY caps, I'd WANT to know and I WOULD go and correct them. If necessary I would add to/modify the public record.
It matters that it be correct.
I would let each surveyor know about their eronous stamping and suggest that they file a Corner Record that documents how they found them and what they did to correct the stamping. Of course, only after the ribbing was done!!
Wow...
Not only do you PLSS guys need a 'manual' to tell you how to survey...you need a cap to tell you where you are when you survey!!!;-) 😉 😛
oh relax....just some east coast ribbing here on a rainy wednesday!!
I'm not positive that I agree that it is that important that it gets repaired. Note the stamping on the cap correctly (by that I mean show how the cap is stamped verbatum) on your notes and your plat and let the surveyor know.
If your are calling to the monument on a description, it is "more important" that you describe the monument correctly. On a monument record I would create it with the correct samping with [sic] next to the typo to note that you saw it and that you are quoting precisely and that the wrong information wasn't your error on the record but that you are showing it as stamped.
I highly doubt that any hiker will get lost because they think their six miles from where they really are because they found your monument, and I highly doubt that any surveyor will not know that it is a "typo" (stamp-o? stampographical error?);-)
Tom
MightyMoe has the right idea. Mostly because he agrees with me :). It really doesn't matter, but you probably should contact the surveyor that set the cap if he’s still around. Aside from that, there’s very little danger of anyone being deluded into thinking that they’re six miles, or even one mile, out of position.
Don
> But there is one thing, all three caps are marked Range 5 East and we are in Range 4 East. Also one quarter corner is for Sections 3 and 4 and marked 2 and 3.
>
> ... does it really matter?
Of course it matters! How are we to expect the pioneers coming in their covered wagons to settle this territory and fulfill manifest destiny peacefully if they mistakenly find the wrong stakes for their land patent and begin plowing and building homes & fences across land which is not their's?
😛
Oh, wait. You're in Utah. Nothing but mountains, desert and a big salty lake out there. Nobody is going to want to settle in that area.
😉
>as far as I can tell good surveyors. But there is one thing, all three caps are marked Range 5 East and we are in Range 4 East. Also one quarter corner is for Sections 3 and 4 and marked 2 and 3.
If they are really "good surveyors", then they would want to be notified, and hopefully would want to make the corrections. All their information should be correct.....I wouldn't want to leave a blunder like that out there.
No biggie. What's 6 miles of confusion among friends (and other surveyors).
*sarcasm off*
Actually, I think I probably would take a play out of the Kent McMillan play book here and just restamp it and go on. Notify them afterward that you did. As a business owner, I'd lose money sending a crew out to restamp what can only be described as a gross error but would really owe the cat who "fixed" it so that it that all was right in the survey world again.
If your a filing state, was a map filed that has the incorrect information listed, and should be concurrently corrected?
I'd call the PLS who is in responsible charge.
I'd want to know...
The work I'm doing is measuring these corners for a good geodetic coordinate. Then a corner record is filed both with the county and the Utah State AGRC (state GIS). They have a program where they are combining the BLM GCDB records with the GIS. Every so often the BLM will turn the crank on the GCDB and with the information on the actual corners that have been measured and the record data in the database, then it will all be updated which will improve the coordinates in the GCDB for search purposes for the remaining corners that haven't been "surveyed" geodetically.
So the filed record includes (at least mine do) a narrative about the corner, the coordinates, pictures the corner status (existent, obliterated or lost), etc.
I'm NOT going back and fix the stamping, but it will be noted in the record I file.
You can go to the website:
They are still improving the site but it's getting better every year.
Records can be submitted online.
This is a great resource and it is going to help tremendously the recovery of PLSS corners in Utah. I hope we soon do the same thing with surveys, that is file them all in one place at the state level where they can be easily searched. It would save a lot of money statewide and make everything uniform. You'd only have to learn one system and the poor counties records would become available online. Some of these will not go online for a long time, maybe never.
> From my point of view, they need to be corrected.
> There are always many things out there to confuse someone.
> It may not be a surveyor who gets confused.
> The surveyors that did the work should come back on their own time and fix it.
> If they don't then anyone with a stamp set should stamp the correction.
> What Quality Control?
> Does the monument record show the actual stamping or the correct stamping?
Agree. And if it was me with the error, (heaven forbid) I would be out there ASAP to fix it or have it fixed.
I wouldn't dream of changing another surveyors work which includes replacing the original stone with a modern monument of any kind. Why do we think that a ferrous metal bar that has been created within the past few years is going to last longer than a stone that has been there for over a hundred years and existed for thousands. I'm all for setting witness markers to the stone but leave the stone alone. I do know this is contrary to the statutes in Colorado and fortunately there are plenty of other surveyors in my area that beat me to the original stones and destroy them but it still makes me somewhat mad when I find a "new" monument and the destroyed remains of the stone laying beside it.
But. The answer to your question is I would make a note of the error and a courtesy call the the surveyor in question.