The?ÿrun in I had with a property owner earlier this week left me a bit rattled. I stake a lot of utility easements and rights of way and angry property owners are par for the course. I can usually smooth things over by letting them rant and run out of steam.?ÿFairly good size job earlier this week, the easement went right through the middle of this fellas yard. It's fairly common with a 60' right of way for the 22' wide gravel road to not be centered in the right of way and in this case it was pushed to the far side of this blokes place and he's treated that ROW as part of his yard. It's also somewhat common with some of our less sophisticated (read badly overweight, tattooed head to toe, mouth breather) residents to assume that they own to the edge of the road. After placing my stakes through his yard I look back to see him with his rather portly wife staring at the stakes and of course I?ÿhad to go?ÿback to explain that there would soon be a fiber optic cable placed in that platted easement. I spent half an hour showing him his pins, the plat, explaining the concept of a right of way and a utility easement, and he was having none of it. He simply said "anybody stepping foot on my property is going to get hurt" and yanked every one of the stakes and flung them. It was the way he said it that made me take him seriously. Informed the client and they went out to talk with him and it led to a shoving match. Now I'm told I'll need to go back out and re-stake that portion when the construction folks show up because it would take too long to get a court injunction and they can't afford the delay, and if I have any problems I should call 911. My reply was do I dial 911 before, or after I get shot because a sucking chest wound might make me difficult to understand when I dial 911.?ÿIt's been my experience that our State Troopers won't respond unless there has been a report of shots fired.
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Rant over, carry on.
Just because I'm paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.
It is very easy for other to put you in harms way. I often think of politics and how easily they send others into battle while they risk nothing.
I would not go out there without a court order and police.
The Land owner may be a tattoo covered mouth breather but he is still the land owner and he made his wishes clear and unambiguous.
The Land owner has rights and you need to stay away.
tell your client that you will not return without a police escort. don't waffle.
Peter is right. Don't wait for holes in your clothes... Clothes cost money, ya know!
Holes in your clothes???? Hell I don't care 'bout the holes in the clothes, it's the holes in the body that would worry me.?ÿ ??ÿ
Wow. ?ÿYikes. ?ÿCourt injunction delay is more costly (valuable) than the land surveyor??s life or safety? ?ÿHard not to take that personally.
The individual issuing the client's orders is an ex-army ranger and his mindset is a little different than mine. He's about to find that out when I refuse to follow his order. I told him no police on site, no stakes. If he wants to find another licensed surveyor, that'll be just fine. Beats holes in my clothes.?ÿ
Just because I'm paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.
hmm... Interested in what his response is...
I bet is that "ex-army ranger" will not volunteer security services ... talk is cheap.
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Wow. ?ÿYikes. ?ÿCourt injunction delay is more costly (valuable) than the land surveyor??s life or safety? ?ÿHard not to take that personally.
No kidding. That wasn't lost on me.
Just because I'm paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.
Been in that situation a few times.?ÿ I see nothing wrong with the owner behaving as if he/she owns to the road shoulder as long as they're not infringing on the public's R/W rights.?ÿ In this case I would have emphasized that once the cable is in he'd not know it was there and could continue his encroaching activities with the same level of risk as before (except digging holes).?ÿ?ÿ
Concerning law enforcement protection the correct agency to utilize is the County Sherriff's office;?ÿ they'll send a Deputy for a fee the same way they serve papers for a fee, which goes to the Deputy, a way for them to make money on the side.?ÿ Mr. Nasty is just looking for a "I fought the law and the law won" scenario, to keep his alpha male ego intact.
There are a few points that will drive the assistance from local authorities. If you have a right of entry statute you should not be charged for having an escort from law enforcement. If your access is being governed strictly by the terms and laws for the easement you may be required to pay a fee.
Given the attitude of the owner, neither of these is likely to be of help unless printed on kevlar or other suitable body armor.
And I forgot to add...
Slighly overweight with tattoos appears to be used in some negative context.. We're not all mouth-breathers?
A couple of decades ago; when I was younger and slightly dumber. I was staking clearing limits for a 24" sewer trunk line, right-of-way line to right-of-way line. I had just finished driving my lath right next to a rebar that marked a property corner, when this guy comes walking out of the house.?ÿ
Him: What's going on?
Me: we're staking the clearing limits for the construction that's going to start next week.
Him: That stake right there, is that where they will be clearing to?
Me: Yes, that's why I wrote clearing limits on it.
Him: Well, they can't take out that tree right there, it's a $10,000 Japanese Maple!
Me: It was kind of stupid of you to plant it in the Right-of-Way, then wasn't it?
WRONG! That was definitely the wrong thing to say! I didn't lose my job, but I did get a stern talking to... ??ÿ
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Homeowner's have an obligation to mow grass and weeds and shovel snow on sidewalks all within the right of way. Since you have been told of a valuable tree within the owner's area of required maintenance you must pass that information on to whoever is going to disturb the ground. The ground disturbing person is obligated to return the ground to it's previous condition. Take careful note of what was said and include it on your survey report to the easement user. I would say that includes standing timber or farmer's crops within an easement. An easement is not fee title, so be careful with what you say and do.
Paul in PA
Aren't they boring there, they seem to bore everything now. They bored my whole neighborhood, it's become so cheap compared to twenty years ago. He would be the perfect guy to bore, he would never even know.
Aren't they boring there, they seem to bore everything now. They bored my whole neighborhood, it's become so cheap compared to twenty years ago. He would be the perfect guy to bore, he would never even know.
Lots of bores around here. Still not that cheap at around $70/ft. and guarantee he'll know. Ground vibrates pretty good. It's along a long curve and typically a guy has to walk ahead to track the boring head. Frankly I think the shoving match with Army Ranger left a bruised ego or two. The price of a bore would be chump change compared to someone getting hurt IMHO. Hopefully cooler heads will prevail.
Just because I'm paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.
This was 20 years ago...
20' deep by the time they got to the pump station. 2 miles total, of sanitary sewer, through an industrial park.
ROW or not. Land owners are due surface damages.
I would not restake snyything without a police escort.
ROW or not. Land owners are due surface damages.
I would not restake snyything without a police escort.
I'm going to agree with you. I'm not comfortable pushing this the way some people above me?ÿwant to. The reality from where I sit?ÿis that where I live darn near everyone is armed, probably not all that different than Texas. Some would argue that at an armed society is a polite society, but every time I turn on the news or pick up the paper I'm hearing about someone getting shot. Very impolite, but so is plowing a 4' trench through someone's lawn against their objections.?ÿWe would all like to think that will never happen to me, but I'm pragmatic?ÿenough to realize that I don't really?ÿknow what's going on in this guy's head and I'm not willing to risk my life or anyone else's to find out.?ÿPush comes to shove I'm going to set up the DC?ÿwith the?ÿcurve data and hand it to Army Ranger and say "If you want this staked again that bad ... Here you go. Have at it."
Just because I'm paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.
Things must work differently, where I work. Most places will work with you, restore it to better than what it was. But if you're going to be a D; you won't have much luck getting what you want. You will even need to provide at least a standard approach, maybe even curb gutter and sidewalk, if it's in a public Right-of-Way and you are doing any kind of improvement to the land. Most of the time, if you're doing any kind of subdivision, you will need to dedicate extra Right-of-Way along any existing public thoroughfare.
Eminent Domain can and does get ugly. I worked for the company that did the wetland assessment for the 3rd runway at SeaTac. The Port of Seattle was displacing over 1,000 families. I located every wet land flag hung for that job, but I wasn't involved in any of the boundary work. There was all kinds of stories to come out. One guy didn't care, as long as his kids could go to the same schools and he could still raise a couple head of cattle. Another guy claimed he was going to develop a multi-million dollar condo and wanted full compensation. His 2 acre parcel was on a steep slope with wetlands. Then there was the guy who was adamant about not leaving. His property was going to be under 300 feet of fill. I really felt sorry for the guy, I think it was old family property along a creek.
Some of us, sometimes, need to take one for the team; suffer for the greater good of all of us...It just sucks when it's you, and it happens in your backyard.
