My complaints against Trimble, the Manufacturer of Trimble GPS receivers for GPS.
1.) They lied about the GLONASS satellites for years, and said that they were no good. Until THEY did it "Right". I have been using a LEGACY E GPS system for years, BEFORE they were able to address the Russian Satellites. They definitely outperformed any of the Trimble products of their time. Since they did not have a product to compete with Javad/Topcon, they lied and slandered them, by speaking evil of them. This began my dis-trust of Trimble as a company.
2.) Now to my next breech of trust with Trimble: My Pac Crest PDL 4500 ROVER radio. Which is YELLOW with the Topcon Label.
Well, I sent it to Pac Crest, for a new battery, (Which is NOW owned by Trimble) and when it came back, it would last about 8-9 hrs. Before I sent it in, it would last about 6-7 hrs. I became suspicious that it had either gotten a bad battery, or something. BECAUSE, when I first got it, (I bought it used, from a construction company) it would last 2+ days, on a charge. (BEFORE it ever went to PAC CREST) I was suspicious that they had put a TOO SMALL battery in it. Well, I sent it in AGAIN, to get the battery replaced. And, sort of the same story. On a full charge, it would last 7-9 hrs, and be spent.
Well, I grew more suspicious, and decided to REPLACE it myself. I did some HARD SHOPPING, only to discover that the battery was NOT AVAILABLE in USA. BUT, was available in Australia, and I found the SPECS for the battery. YEAH! Here are the specs:
GPSB-PDL4500-BP1 - Lithium Ion - 3.7V - 2400mAh 18.6mm x 68mm From this web site: http://www.yankeeroo.com/store/product.php?productid=31687&cat=662&page=7
So, as I replaced it, I found that PAC CREST had indeed UNDERSIZED the battery!
It came back with a 1.5 AH battery. Original spec calls for a 2.4 AH battery. Not just once, but 2x! (I have the proof, this second time)
When I just opened it up, and found that 1.5 AH battery, It made me madder than blue blazes.
They INTENTIONALLY put an UNDER spec battery in it. So it would have to have a new battery more often, and would not run as long. The effects of this would: make it have to be sent in about once every yr or 2, and LAST LESS TIME. I have lost work, because they did this to me. I have had to cut days short, because of the undersized battery.
Just makes me mad at them.
I just finished changing to the new battery. And charged it. It took longer to charge than the old one did. I kept the electronic device that was up against the side of the battery, and soldered back to tabs.
Here is the battery I put in mine: http://www.batteryspace.com/ultra-high-energy-li-ion-18650-cylindrical-rechargeable-cell-3.7v-2800mah.aspx.
So, IF you send ANYTHING to PAC CREST, AKA TRIMBLE, ask what size battery it is supposed to have, and what size they put back in it.
I have no idea how many things that big companies like this could deliberately sabotage, but I was sabotaged by Trimble.
And, I do not know if they ONLY do this to stuff with TOPCON labels, or if they do this to OLDER stuff across the board. BUT, I will be keeping this old battery, and pictures of it all on hand. I will post some pics of the OLD battery, and the new one, for your general inspection. I have the proof. IF you have an old PDL – 4500, the allen screws on the bottom open into the battery compartment. There are warnings, about LITHUIM ION batteries, being NON user serviceable. I blew past those, and unwrapped it, and found their dirty little secret.
I have been betrayed. I will be avoiding Trimble with deliberate effort now.
Nate
And you're surprised?
I suppose it's not just Trimble, but they screwed us over on TGO / TBC. Sure they offered a good price on the "upgrade", but the only reason we had to do it was because of their non-responsiveness to fixing their mistake.
And now we're getting the shaft again with the radios that will be non-compliant in a couple of months. Oh sure, they're offering another "deal" that will only cost $2500 this time to replace a perfectly good radio.
I really like my R-8's, but this is getting old.
Yeah, I'm surprised
Because original Specs called for a 2.4 AH battery. They put a 1.5 AH battery. This is pure sabotage. I would not suspect that they would UNDER spec it. This required that the Parent company send a directive to the lower echelon workers, and require them to COOPERATE in this scam. I just emailed the guy at pac crest that did the repairs. I'm waiting to hear back from him.
Nate
Yeah, I'm surprised
I doubt they did this just to ruin your day Nate, or to make you get it sent in more often. This is probably just a battery they have easy acess to and didn't go through the trouble to find the correct battery like you did.
My gripe with Trimble has been the fact to update your software or the firmware in your receivers has always been an expensive afair. Its kind of like getting on the Autocad bandwagon. It seems like the lock you into this yearly thing. I hate to break the news to you, but Topcon is doing the same thing now. We just bought a new set of HiperII's, and the dealer says Topcon will now be charging for firmware updates and such.
A lot of times, depending on how you use your equipment, you can go years without upgrading any of your stuff and never know the difference.
Also Trimble owns TDS now, and in my opinion, have pretty much pulled the plug on that entire line of pretty popopular data collection software. We upgraded to the latest version of TDS on our Ranger so we can run our new receivers. In my opinion its the biggest piece of junk and was a waste of money. Its very buggy and locks up all the time. The previous version was pretty solid, but we had to have it to run our new receivers.
Yeah, I'm surprised
THEY are supposed to know what capacity of battery to install. I will post pics of what I found, as soon as I get them uploaded.
This sort of thing is not ethical.
At this point, TRIMBLE denies putting a 2.4AH battery in it. I mean, that is like Harold Camping DENYING that he made false prediction about Christ's return!
Nate
I don't know. It just torques me wrong
For the company to NOT release schematics, and to publish the idea that it HAS to come home for a new battery, and then for me to "Trust" them, send it back, and the get it back TWICE with an under capacity battery. It's not the $150 bucks or so for a new battery. It is the UNDER CAPACITY battery. That buggs me. I know thee was bad blood between JAVAD and Charlie Trimble. This will get me taking sides, in a fierce way!
Here are the pics of the battery I found in it. The purple Panasonic 18650H is the one that PAC Crest installed in it. 
You can read the WHITE shrink wrap label. It clearly says that it is a 1.5 AH battery.
Nate
Here is a ZOOM in on that white label
You can clearly read that it says:
"3.7V 1.5 Ah Li-ION"
When I looked up the Panasonic Battery, it is listed as a 1.5 AH battery.
Nate
Here is a ZOOM in on that white label
I get the impression that Nate is irked, and not unreasonably so.
Reminds me of one of my favorite sayings: Never give a client the impression you are sticking it to them. They don't like it, and neither would you.
Here is a ZOOM in on that white label
I have been running with UNDER capacity batteries for 4 yrs, because that TRIMBLE has aggressive business practices.
Well, I am a little guy, and I can and will fight back the way I can... tell others, and avoid supporting them.
What else can I do?
Anybody else want to take a peek into their PDL 4500, and see if it has the right battery? I would, if I cared about it. And, wanted performance out of it.
Nate
Yeah, I'm surprised
Where did you find the 2.4ah spec for the battery - an official site, manual, or battery supplier?
The site you referenced lists similar batteries ranging from 1.5ah to 2.8ah. The differences could be the voltage dropoff characteristics.
Too bad you didn't ask for the old batteries back.
Yeah, I'm surprised
Tyler, here is the link:
http://www.yankeeroo.com/store/product.php?productid=31687&cat=662&page=7 br>
There USED to be other links, and places you could buy them in the US, but when I went looking for them, they were gone.
The specs were the same as the one above.
In email discussions, with PAC CREST, they also agreed that I had the right specs.
I am not against an American company, trying to make a living. I am against direct fraud, of installing an UNDER Capacity battery, as this would have a chain reaction, and make me frustrated, and cause me to buy newer equipment, when they deliberately scuttled my old equipment.
I do not believe that this was an accident.
Nate
Yeah, I'm surprised
I was just curious where you got the specs as a manufacturer is usually very closed about revealing that type of info.
It's certainly not about cost as the difference in price for the various capacity cells is minimal - less that about $2 on an $8 item. Even after tabbing the cells, attaching leads and terminal, and labelling, and of course, stocking for a projected demand.
If you ordered a bare cell, I hope you got tabs attached. It's not good to solder directly to any battery cell. The heat can destroy some types of batteries in a second. If you got the shrink-wrapped package, should be no problem.
Nice going on DIY!
PS Looked again at your first pic and it appears you did get the tabbed cell.
Yeah, I'm surprised
Tyler,
That link has all of the basic specs. I ordered it with tabs. (0.25 Cents more, per cell) I ordered an extra cell, as you never know who else may need one!
They were not shrink wrapped. I took the device off the old one, soldered the tabs to the tabs, wrapped it, charged it, installed it, and she works fine.
Are you in any way connected to Trimble?
I don't like to be a jerk to any manufacturer. But "to be lied to, about something so small, that can be so big, just connects my battery terminals to the I hate you juice"!
It took all night charge. The old one took usually just 3 hrs to charge.
Cheers!
Nate
Nope
Not connected in any way to Trimble - well, except they bought out a couple of systems I was using - TDS and Terramodel. I live only about 1/2 mile from TDS. I used to be able to walk in and get tech support. Can't do that now and I don't know anyone there anymore either.
I wonder why no US company advertises those batteries.
Nope
Those little batteries have some sort of device on the side, that monitors voltage, and probably also cuts off the charger, when full, and whatever else it does, well I don't know. I used the old one.
One thing I can say about it, PAC CREST packed it good.
I'd like to hear from somebody else that got a low capacity battery, and I am sure that if they did, that Trimble will know nothing.... Just like mine.
N
Yeah, I'm surprised
>
>
> At this point, TRIMBLE denies putting a 2.4AH battery in it. (This should say 1.5Ah) I mean, that is like Harold Camping DENYING that he made false prediction about Christ's return!
>
> Nate
And you're surprised?
The TGO upgrade is really not fair in my opinion. I never really used TGO and was not aware of the discontinuance, so I did not know about the discount cost grace period. So when I started needing to use it they want $3,000. I will never ever ever ever forget that.
And you're surprised?
I was a huge Trimble fan in the nineties and spend $14K on a Trimble GP Survey Software Package. Then came Y2K and the software quit working, Trimbles response was you will need to upgrade to TGO to process data and they did not waiver from that. The last Trimble product I bought was the upgrade to TGO.
Trimble-Topcon-Leica-etc
All the big names, and big players are crunching the competition. Buying up smaller companies.
As my memory serves:
Trimble owns:
TDS
Terra Model
Pac Crest
Topcon owns:
Lietz-Sokia
I dunno about Leica.
But I don't know what else. We the consumers should have a data collector, that ALLOWS us to work with anybody we want. I don't want to be stuck with a brand.
The coding that allows a DC to work, being somewhat propitiatory, seems to be the glitch. Some big player needs to come up with a DC that EVERYBODY wants to "play" with. Then, we the consumer, can do as we please. The general recent trend is not heading that way.
Does anybody remember the good ole days?
Nate
Trimble-Topcon-Leica-etc
I exchanged emails with a rep from TRIMBLE. They never admitted to anything.
Must be modernists, in their thinking.
🙂
N
