I have a project here in town that we're being asked to do a boundary survey and write a perimeter description for some monitoring wells. Originally our field crew went to the site prepared to search and locate all pertinent boundary corners. The crew chief got a good tone and put his sharpshooter in the ground and found a pin! (amazing, I know) Immediately after this amazing event, our client representative on site told us we couldn't dig to recover corners.
We left the site and through correspondence rescheduled a trip to the site, with the clients utility locators. They wanted to scan the area we wanted to dig for underground utilities BEFORE we disturbed the ground looking for a property corner. Then that turned into, "you can't dig within 10' of an underground utility, sprinkler system, drainage system or otherwise utility designator". Um...then how do we recover a property corner that is drove into the same ground where you're worried about utilities?
Today we're back at the site, trying to dig where we have a "good tone" from our pin finder, while the locators are onsite....again.
This is a new one for me and has gotten beyond ridiculous and is quickly becoming laughable.
I don't know about others, but I wouldn't have them for clients much longer after something like that. Life's too short to deal with idiots and attempt to appear professional while working under the direction of the client.
Big company, big bosses are probably remote from the actual work but close to the net profit.
Work it into your fee.
Squirltech, post: 390996, member: 11959 wrote: ...our client representative on site told us we couldn't dig to recover corners...
As long as you (and your company) get properly compensated for the time and effort then it's just what has to be done. I've worked on some sites where safety, security or HAZMAT concerns severley limited productivity. Nevertheless, they were very lucrative jobs because the client paid for the wait time.
Squirltech, post: 390996, member: 11959 wrote: Then that turned into, "you can't dig within 10' of an underground utility, sprinkler system, drainage system .
"What some idiot placed a utility within 10 feet of a property corner? How can we survey with idiots placing their facilities so dangerously close to the corners? This will be an additional fee to determine that the corners were not disturbed by the installation of your utilities."
Oh...almost forgot
The property is surrounded by a fence. The property corner was located outside of the fence enclosure. Because the corner was "outside of the fence", it was on someone else property and we couldn't access it either. I told our crew chief that until we did the survey, we weren't sure where the property actually is and to do that, we need to recover that corner. No dice.
Update:
Crew chief has called and said he was able to recover 4 of the 7 corners we were needing so at this point, we're able to complete the project.
Squirltech, post: 390996, member: 11959 wrote: becoming laughable
Ya gotta laugh. For your sanity. Laugh dammit! :smarty:
It's not really done until you can report that you have made a deliberate search for those other three corners and they were either found and shot or reset and shot. Here, we would have to be able to honestly report that if the judge were to ask. Maybe not so much in Texas.
Holy Cow, post: 391021, member: 50 wrote: It's not really done until you can report that you have made a deliberate search for those other three corners and they were either found and shot or reset and shot. Here, we would have to be able to honestly report that if the judge were to ask. Maybe not so much in Texas.
He searched for all 7 corners but only recovered 4 of them.
It's different in Texas...that's for sure. 😉
Holy Cow, post: 391021, member: 50 wrote: It's not really done until you can report that you have made a deliberate search for those other three corners and they were either found and shot or reset and shot. Here, we would have to be able to honestly report that if the judge were to ask. Maybe not so much in Texas.
And if they're not there; how can you set your corner without the risk of damage to a utility or sprinkler system? The only way to be sure; hire a utility locate company that uses a non-evasive method of pot-holing the physical utility, under the ground; like with a VAC truck...
Also; inform the client that this is not part of the original scope of work, as defined in your contract and that there will be additional fees owed for this effort.
I'd hand the representative the shovel and tell him to dig, cause it's gonna take digging to find the monuments and see what happens.
His next comment will probably be that you can not drive any new monuments to replace any missing ones.
Ah yes. DigTESS. Yes, they are trying to make it the rule that we, as surveyors, are considers excavators, and cannot, in Texas, disturb the soil until we put in a call locate request and get a locate ticket completed! We cannot dig for a corner nor can we drive a rod. Of course, most of us are hoping that rule does not become standard, but it is becoming more and more common for large companies to think they should follow this practice. And at the same time, the locate company is allowed to mislocate by up to 10 feet, but if we dig and hit the mismarked line, it is still our fault for hitting the line. Trust me on that, it is an expensive thing to hit a mislocated line.
I once drove a rebar through a water line. I wound up giving them $100 for their water bill. I honestly suspect they just stuck it in their pocket.
I asked them what they were doing placing a private WATER LINE in the R/W? this caused them to pause... they saw where I was going... they did not have a survey, so they could know where to place the water line... and the survey hit their line... Chicken or egg?
🙂
Nate The Surveyor, post: 391048, member: 291 wrote: I once drove a rebar through a water line. I wound up giving them $100 for their water bill. I honestly suspect they just stuck it in their pocket.
I asked them what they were doing placing a private WATER LINE in the R/W? this caused them to pause... they saw where I was going... they did not have a survey, so they could know where to place the water line... and the survey hit their line... Chicken or egg?
🙂
They should be required to have a surveyor come out and check for any boundary marks and stake their easement before they lay down their utilities. They should mark their utilities for design purposes so a surveyor can show where their flags are in order for the designer to know what underground utilities s/he has to deal with. They should be penalized if they take out pins and/or their lines encroach out of the easement (or the right-of-way that they have permission to be in.
But that's just my opinion I guess.
Tom Adams, post: 391055, member: 7285 wrote: They should be required to have a surveyor come out and check for any boundary marks and stake their easement before they lay down their utilities. They should mark their utilities for design purposes so a surveyor can show where their flags are in order for the designer to know what underground utilities s/he has to deal with. They should be penalized if they take out pins and/or their lines encroach out of the easement (or the right-of-way that they have permission to be in.
[MEDIA=youtube]RV-p51fvYLc[/MEDIA]
RADAR, post: 391023, member: 413 wrote: And if they're not there; how can you set your corner without the risk of damage to a utility or sprinkler system? The only way to be sure; hire a utility locate company that uses a non-evasive method of pot-holing the physical utility, under the ground; like with a VAC truck...
Also; inform the client that this is not part of the original scope of work, as defined in your contract and that there will be additional fees owed for this effort.
non-invasive (I keep telling myself not to play spelling-police, but sometimes I just can't help it)
I worked a job where the locator marked a phone line down the curb and gutter. The grade was being changed for a new structure to replace an existing. Contractor get a backhoe to carefully rip out the CG. First bite of the CG rips the phone line as it was embedded in the concrete. It cost him about $2000 to have the phone company replace the line and he had to dig their trench. If I set a pin I call USA to have them locate utilities. Better being safe.
"Commencing at a metal detector tone (maybe) indicating the subsurface presence of the iron pipe shown at the NW corner of the Fugawi Tract, thence South 500 feet to a much stronger metal detector tone...."
I like it better like this:
"Commencing at a BEEP (maybe) indicating the subsurface presence of the iron pipe shown at the NW corner of the Fugawi Tract, thence South 500 feet to a much stronger BEEP...." 🙂
