need a new gps....

I use the Javad Triumph LS, and I love it. I can not imagine using any other device. I take it deep into the woods.
It will read and write every file format I need. It can import or export my fully layered Auto cad drawings. No need for Field to Finish. It is finished.

Along with several others that post here, I also happen to support, and help with sales. I think it is coming close to time to pay for a banner here. (FWIW, my involvement with this forum, and it predecessor is decades older than my relationship with Javad. I am not here to sell, only offer help, and answer questions.)

I also believe that you owe it to yourself to look at all systems, and in fairness, even overlook a bad salesman.

2 yrs ago, I got back to my base, and, as is my custom, I set an extra base spike, a little ways from my operating base station. While putting the rest of my gear away, I observe an extra shot. It gives me redundancy, in case my base has a tractor, or such parked on it, or gets destroyed.
A gust of wind blew my rover over. It broke the screen on my data collector.
Go back several months.
I had Shawn Billings come to Arkansas, and demo the Javad LS.
We cut to the chase. After getting his base running, we had him place the rover on a cotton spindle, in a grove of natural growth young pines, maybe 30 or 40 feet tall, and intermixed with older hardwoods, and some old growth pines. It was one of those non-rtk places. At this time, the LS was not able to post process, or run at 5 hz.
It took it about 45 mins. And it gave us a fully verified shot, with a bit larger than avreage residuals. We were impressed.
We then watched it do "lift and tilt" (thats a mode, that directly draws linework, and curves in the open). It's the Javad way to do FTF. Then, we went back, and re-observed that cotton spindle, in the pines. Sure enough, it took it about 15 mins, and we had another confirmed shot, a tenth from the first one.
It was substantially better than anything we'd ever seen.
So, fast foreward to my broken data collector, and I ordered the Javad system.
It has been an awesome machine.
I have never gone back to my old system. (I did replace the data collector... But have yet to use it!)
I'd recomend the Javad system, with enthusiasm. I make no money off saying this.

Nate

John Evers, post: 428160, member: 467 wrote: time to pay for a banner here

rplsntx, post: 428131, member: 8904 wrote: i actually demo'ed a leica gs14 and my carlson got a lock where the leica wouldn't (and the accuracy on carlson while leica wasn't locked was acceptable also).

Leica, rather famously, places a priority on being absolutely correct all the time over getting positions in marginal conditions. It's not really a matter of capability, it's philosophical.

As far as buying new equipment goes I think that you really have to look at your office processes first, then your data collection software, then the after sales support, and then finally the receiver hardware. I expect that if you compare the latest receivers, head to head - apples with apples so to speak, that there isn't going to be a great deal of difference. These new receivers routinely get positions in places we never would have dreamed of going with RTK 10 years ago.

rplsntx, post: 428131, member: 8904 wrote: any ideas on what gps?
what i have now is a carlson network rover - the older type with passive antenna and surveyor+ gps module on back.... and it works VERY well.
i actually demo'ed a leica gs14 and my carlson got a lock where the leica wouldn't (and the accuracy on carlson while leica wasn't locked was acceptable also). what i didn't like about the leica is that i couldn't take a file off my carlson and use it on leica... not even a dxf file - you must use a flash drive formatted to leica. also other reasons and i'm not liking leica and the cs20 seemed too fluffy. and the dealer rubbed me wrong when he tried to tell me that i was in an area that wasn't optimal. but that's another post.

so any ideas on a gps? i am looking for a network rover. but i am also looking for a base/rover... so i need this gps to work as both. anybody have experience with both the leica and carlso brx5 ? and or the javad and how they compare. thanks for replies.

I have used the gs14 and the brx5 both as network rovers. I bought a brx5 due to budget but will admit I like the gs14 better. The Gs14 feels better on top of the rod (less top heavy) and I think gets fixed faster. Both are great units. If money is not an issue I would look towards the gs16 or the bx6. As time goes on gps units keep improving.

Depends on what your looking for, if you want top of the line, get a Trimble R10, if you want the best deal for your money get a CHC X91+ and than there's Javad that appears to have enthusiastic users. I was in your shoes awhile back and the key point was, NEW IS BETTER, go with whatever brand you like. There is no magic GPS unit. I currently have 3 Topcon Hiper Lite+'s with Rangers and Survey Pro which have been excellent units. I purchased a couple of X91+'s from Igage at the end of last year with Carlson's Surveyor2. I use Carlson Survey OEM version on my computers. Not having to import and export ascii files back and forth, is a big plus for my new purchase and the new units are better under or near the canopy plus the internal radio has substantially more range.

I hired a GS14 base GS15 rover last year.
I was very impressed and was really impressed with by its ability to go places I would not have expected it.
Our gum trees aren't as dense as some of your trees and found it fixing under canopy of medium dense gums.
I've found Leica support here 100%.
It gave me continuously good comparisons on same points over 3 days. All within 10mm.
I used a base.
I'd be happy to park that or their latest in my vehicle.
Support is important. Can you renegotiate with the rep?

thank you guys for the replies..

JMH4825, post: 428255, member: 10876 wrote: I have used the gs14 and the brx5 both as network rovers. I bought a brx5 due to budget but will admit I like the gs14 better. The Gs14 feels better on top of the rod (less top heavy) and I think gets fixed faster. Both are great units. If money is not an issue I would look towards the gs16 or the bx6. As time goes on gps units keep improving.

thank you... that was one thing i was wondering... what it felt like on top of the pole. so i will give that one to leica.

John Evers, post: 428160, member: 467 wrote: I use the Javad Triumph LS, and I love it. I can not imagine using any other device. I take it deep into the woods.
It will read and write every file format I need. It can import or export my fully layered Auto cad drawings. No need for Field to Finish. It is finished.

Along with several others that post here, I also happen to support, and help with sales. I think it is coming close to time to pay for a banner here. (FWIW, my involvement with this forum, and it predecessor is decades older than my relationship with Javad. I am not here to sell, only offer help, and answer questions.)

I also believe that you owe it to yourself to look at all systems, and in fairness, even overlook a bad salesman.

thank you... just to make it clear - i do overlook the salesmen. but i do listen when they try to sell. as we were walking toward the trees, he says to me "now you'll be really impressed by how well it works under these trees." 20m later - no fix yet.
what i would like to know is how the photogrammetry works. like in the addy for triumph, they have a guy taking pics of a gas station and the triumphs looks like it makes a rough drawing of the building by taking pics and several observations around the bldg.

Nate The Surveyor, post: 428184, member: 291 wrote: 2 yrs ago, I got back to my base, and, as is my custom, I set an extra base spike, a little ways from my operating base station. While putting the rest of my gear away, I observe an extra shot. It gives me redundancy, in case my base has a tractor, or such parked on it, or gets destroyed.
A gust of wind blew my rover over. It broke the screen on my data collector.
Go back several months.
I had Shawn Billings come to Arkansas, and demo the Javad LS.
We cut to the chase. After getting his base running, we had him place the rover on a cotton spindle, in a grove of natural growth young pines, maybe 30 or 40 feet tall, and intermixed with older hardwoods, and some old growth pines. It was one of those non-rtk places. At this time, the LS was not able to post process, or run at 5 hz.
It took it about 45 mins. And it gave us a fully verified shot, with a bit larger than avreage residuals. We were impressed.
We then watched it do "lift and tilt" (thats a mode, that directly draws linework, and curves in the open). It's the Javad way to do FTF. Then, we went back, and re-observed that cotton spindle, in the pines. Sure enough, it took it about 15 mins, and we had another confirmed shot, a tenth from the first one.
It was substantially better than anything we'd ever seen.
So, fast foreward to my broken data collector, and I ordered the Javad system.
It has been an awesome machine.
I have never gone back to my old system. (I did replace the data collector... But have yet to use it!)
I'd recomend the Javad system, with enthusiasm. I make no money off saying this.

Nate

thank you Nate... so you're saying that the javad helped you out in a bind (sorta).? does the LS post process in the field?

Mark Mayer, post: 428205, member: 424 wrote: Leica, rather famously, places a priority on being absolutely correct all the time over getting positions in marginal conditions. It's not really a matter of capability, it's philosophical.

As far as buying new equipment goes I think that you really have to look at your office processes first, then your data collection software, then the after sales support, and then finally the receiver hardware. I expect that if you compare the latest receivers, head to head - apples with apples so to speak, that there isn't going to be a great deal of difference. These new receivers routinely get positions in places we never would have dreamed of going with RTK 10 years ago.

you are right! if the results are a little different, they are the ones that are right...they say

billvhill, post: 428259, member: 8398 wrote: Depends on what your looking for, if you want top of the line, get a Trimble R10, if you want the best deal for your money get a CHC X91+ and than there's Javad that appears to have enthusiastic users. I was in your shoes awhile back and the key point was, NEW IS BETTER, go with whatever brand you like. There is no magic GPS unit. I currently have 3 Topcon Hiper Lite+'s with Rangers and Survey Pro which have been excellent units. I purchased a couple of X91+'s from Igage at the end of last year with Carlson's Surveyor2. I use Carlson Survey OEM version on my computers. Not having to import and export ascii files back and forth, is a big plus for my new purchase and the new units are better under or near the canopy plus the internal radio has substantially more range.

thank you... do the r10's really perform well enough to justify the price? they sure are expensive

Richard, post: 428260, member: 833 wrote: I hired a GS14 base GS15 rover last year.
I was very impressed and was really impressed with by its ability to go places I would not have expected it.
Our gum trees aren't as dense as some of your trees and found it fixing under canopy of medium dense gums.
I've found Leica support here 100%.
It gave me continuously good comparisons on same points over 3 days. All within 10mm.
I used a base.
I'd be happy to park that or their latest in my vehicle.
Support is important. Can you renegotiate with the rep?

i would have liked to see how it worked as base rover but i demo'd a net rover. what kind of range did you get with the internal radio? i hear about a mile is it. what did you get in that cover or what was your longest?
t/y

rplsntx, post: 428268, member: 8904 wrote: what i would like to know is how the photogrammetry works.

In my opinion, you'd have to have an unusual work situation for the photogrammetry option to be worth the $1500 that I believe it costs. Unlike a scanner, this approach requires a lot of image manipulation for each discrete point produced. For most applications I think a reflectorless total station would produce better results much faster. It's an interesting tool, but not cost-effective for typical surveying needs.

rplsntx, post: 428272, member: 8904 wrote: what kind of range did you get with the internal radio?

I didn't have an opportunity to test it but I was concerned.
The job (at Maria Island on east coast Tasmania) was part up a valley, heavily timbered and about 1.8 km from open country where I setup my base for the job elsewhere.
I broke it in two as the terrain and the timber prevented a signal getting through.
I managed the first at only 800 metres but that was fortunate as it was down the valley. The open ground there was not very large and I had limited places to put an intermediate. Fortunately worked well and I repeated same twice on two days and was rapt with the result. (the agreement or figures it spat out!)
Other leg was 1 km.
When I picked up the GPS the bloke leasing ran me through procedures,
We were able to pick up a few network bases around southeast Tasmania. One was near the job about 160 km away,
As there was proper control on the island I was working on I stuck to my 14/15 setup.

below was the intermediate base

This was the work area.
The bush I surveyed successfully in was southwest of the left side of baseline end
there are 3 houses up there and underground services, never did I get a poor fix in tracing those service lines.
As said, I was very impressed.
In my case if I was to purchase I would not hesitate to buy from the person I dealt with, but that comes with many years of dealing with that firm and the excellent service in regards to Leica GPS from him and Leica Australia (C R Kennedy)

rplsntx, post: 428269, member: 8904 wrote: does the LS post process in the field?

If you have an internet connection then yes.

John Evers, post: 428160, member: 467 wrote:

Along with several others that post here, I also happen to support, and help with sales. I think it is coming close to time to pay for a banner here.

I need a new GPS TOO! Started with researching the Javad, then the salesman said to look at the GS16, then the next salesman said to look at the Geomax Zenith 35, he said same unit as GS16, only "yellow" instead of green.

So is the Geomax 35 going to do the job in canopy?

For the difference in price, "yellow" looks better than "green", especially if color is the only difference.

and cost is definitely a factor since it looks like the Android "O" (or even 7.0) will offer GNSS positioning using the same constellations as survey grade units!

One thing to beware of is apparently new or ex demo kit being sold which has passed 'end of life' and is unsupported. I've noticed two dealer sites selling the package I have (bought in 2007, reached end of life at least a year ago) + a data collector which is also unsupported.
As always, caveat emptor.