Adding fill around one side of the house to raise LAG

Hi Doug and Kelly,

First, I'd like to welcome you to RPLS Today, and thank you for your post! 🙂

Secondly, I just wanted to let you know that Saturdays are typically our slowest day. So you might not get much response until tomorrow and/or Monday.

Hope you have a great weekend! 🙂

Thanks Wendell,?ÿ

Appreciate the warm welcome. I look forward to engaging in a nice and productive discussions here. Thanks once again

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Doug

Wendell (in my not so humble opinion) is a little bit too shy to ask for your financial gratitude if you are ultimately able to find valuable help here. ?ÿSo I will do so on his behalf. ?ÿSee the link in my signature line. ?ÿBest of luck with your project.

Hi Brad,?ÿ

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Thanks for the link. I just donated, whether I find the right info i am looking for or not i did my part to help the community going.?ÿ

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Doug

Doug, your contribution is greatly appreciated. I don't think guests should feel obligated to contribute in any way, nothing shy about it. I'm glad you found us and I hope you find the answers you are looking for. 🙂

Through DM I have been advised to share the EC so it would be easier for you guys to chime in. So here it is along with a property flood loss report from FEMA and some pics.

FAX_20180508_1525803849_149.pdf

Doc May 08, 2018, 15_06 (2).pdf

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Also on the pictures of the house you will see that its been staked to where we need to raise. Now i just need to know where to take from here. I know most people want to get away from paying insurance, my case if I could get out of the insurance great, but the real reason is to do what we want in terms of renovations and not have to go by the 50% rule as the house is old and 50% of the market value of the structure will not go far. This is a house for me and my family not a flip. Hopefully you guys can shine a light on it for me.

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Thanks for the tips Dan B. Robinson

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Doug

Step number one would be to permanently fill and seal the basement and move that machinery to be level with the main floor or higher. ?ÿThen, re-landscape your entire yard to be a tad bit higher than BFE for the first 20 feet out from all sides of the perimeter of the house. ?ÿRe-sod. ?ÿWait two years. ?ÿHave a new insurance company contract with a different surveyor to do an EC while you are out of town.

P.S. You didn't hear this from me.?ÿ

Having an unfinished basement is out of the equation even with the machines relocated to the first floor? Also who has access to the CE the surveyor did? Just me and him? He does not submit it anywhere correct?

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Doug

You should be the only one the surveyor provided with copies of the EC.?ÿ

I prepared an EC for a fellow in Zone A.?ÿ Frame dwelling on a rubble masonry cellar about 5.5' deep.?ÿ Furnace & water heater in the cellar.?ÿ In determining the BFE from the FIS and then measuring the various elevations around/in the structure, it happened that the LAG was a solid 0.10 feet above the BFE.

So, I submitted a LOMA request to FEMA and it was granted, coming back that FEMA had determined that the BFE was actually 0.2 below the LAG, so my client got the LOMA.?ÿ Furnace & water heater 5+ feet below BFE.

What are you going to do about the basement windows??ÿ?ÿ

Sorry for the alphabet soup.

Doug,

If you haven't already, take a look at FEMA P-758 (2010) "Substantial Improvement/ Substantial Damage Desk Reference".

https://www.fema.gov/media-library-data/20130726-1734-25045-2915/p_758_complete_r3.pdf

This is probably what your local Floodplain Administrators are going by.

DDSM

Interesting he got LOMA even though machinery was way below BFE but I am attaching a screenshot from what I found on FEMA website about flood insurance coverage for basement contents. I was planning on adding cinder block to meet the height i need around the two windows I need and install those clear covers. All other basement windows are above BFE. Also attached pics of the two windows that I am planning to add some height to the surrounding concrete.?ÿ

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Doug

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Will read it. Thank you.?ÿ

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Its good to note that the main reason of this whole thing while it would be good to not have to pay $2500 a year in flood insurance but its the 50% rule is what I am trying to avoid. There has never been any water issue in my property or the neighbors properties. If I only know about this prior to purchase. Too late now I must move forward 🙂

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Doug

Based on the info I've seen, I would raise the LAG with fill, and go for the LOMR-F.?ÿ I am not, however, there.?ÿ It seems that the LOCAL surveyor who's helped you so far should be the guy advising you now.?ÿ Good luck!

That is most likely what we will do. Can the floodplain administrators have a say perhaps not allow fill to be placed in order to apply for the?ÿ ?ÿLOMR-F? I dont know what kind of authority they have. I have been told the town of Fairfield CT is pretty tough on flood zones. I will go there tomorrow to bring my house appraisal to at least increase my spending power as far as the 50% rule goes. Thanks for the great advice @sergeant-schultz

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Doug

Doug, I have been out of active practice for a dozen years, but I believe the process you need to go through is called a CLOMR-F. The letters stand for Conditional Letter of Map Revision based on Fill.

The "Conditional" part means that you submit a site plan showing the proposed re-grading. Local officials review it, and the application then goes to FEMA. If they approve it, you are in effect pre-approved for a LOMR-F once the re-grading has been completed in accordance with the plan. The LOMR-F takes your property, or at least the part of it your house is on, out of the regulatory flood zone.

I remember seeing a site plan for a CLOMR-F. It was prepared by engineers from the firm I worked for. There were two elements. The first was placing fill to raise the LAG. The second was creating a hollow area to provide extra space for flood water. That was required because the fill occupied some of the volume that previously existed next to the building. You have to leave the same amount of volume below the BFE as there was when you started. Otherwise some of the flood water could be pushed onto other properties.

So you might end up with a low area on your property, something like a sunken garden. The cut-out area could be landscaped, and you'd still come out ahead because you'd no longer have to pay $2K a year for flood insurance and you wouldn't be subject to the 50% rule. You could still get flood insurance--I would carry it under the circumstances--but it wouldn't be mandatory and would probably cost more like $500 a year.

You need to work with someone who knows how to prepare a grading plan for a CLOMR-F and is familiar with the regulatory process. That might mean an engineer rather than a surveyor, although survey work would still be needed.

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John,

I'm not saying I know for sure but what you describe may be a remediation if the structure is within a floodway as opposed to just being in a floodplain.

Dave.

Dave, you raise an interesting point. I checked on the FEMA site, and it looks as though the requirements for compensatory storage may be set by local regulations rather than nationwide policies--

https://www.fema.gov/compensatory-storage

John

Thanks for the link John.

Dave.