Fences that have been accepted for at least 70 years enclose a parcel that has a deed calling for a 13 x 11 rod rectangle. The fences support that size. The corner of the rectangle measures 35 rods from the section corner. The deed calls for 35 rods 9 1/2 ft. The deed has never been reworded. The parcel started of as a country school about a century and a half ago.
Someone who laid out the rectangle dropped the 9 1/2 ft. way back when it appears.
Assuming most if not all surveyors would say the boundary is and always has been the fence, what next?
Boundary line agreement?
Boundary line adjustment?
Deed correction?
Measured as, Recorded as on the survey?
Something else?
PS - those who think the fences are off 9 1/2', just say no to math.
corrective deed. the only thing in error is the pob.
This is one of those "I really don't get the problem" moment. We run into this all the time, and we write M&B descriptions on everything, so that's what gets recorded. So if you're doing this for a conveyance, write a new M&B, if you're just doing it for the private landowner, write a new one and suggest they file it in the court house. If you're in a recording state, file the plat.
Am I missing something here? There are jobs where if the tract is within 100', I'm very happy.
I had a similar situation and determined that the persons who laid out the boundary and wrote the description had obviously pulled from one of the bearing trees, not the actual corner position.
On that note, are you certain the position of the section corner is still the same position as when the parcel was created? I came across 2 section corners recently that had been incorrectly reconstructed by forestors after logging had wiped them out. They put them back close to where they thought they should be, but missed several clues as to the true position. One was off 30' and another 5'.
The parcel started of as a country school about a century and a half ago.
Think I would be looking for evidence of the GLO corner another 9 1/2 feet out from where it is today. Find evidence of it there, you will need to make another decision about what to do, but you will know the original writing was good.
jud
Alternate location was excavated. no evidence recovered. Present corner is certified and agrees with surrounding properties with the exception of the 9 1/2 ft. distance.
One other peice of info.
Your client is the adjoiner on three sides. That deed states "except blabla" same description.
So what next? Nothing. Maybe so. I was just wondering what you all thought.
Actually writing a new M & B is doing something. Some might say it is deed reformation.
> Fences that have been accepted for at least 70 years enclose a parcel that has a deed calling for a 13 x 11 rod rectangle. The fences support that size. The corner of the rectangle measures 35 rods from the section corner. The deed calls for 35 rods 9 1/2 ft. The deed has never been reworded. The parcel started of as a country school about a century and a half ago.
>
> Someone who laid out the rectangle dropped the 9 1/2 ft. way back when it appears.
>
> Assuming most if not all surveyors would say the boundary is and always has been the fence, what next?
>
> Boundary line agreement?
> Boundary line adjustment?
> Deed correction?
> Measured as, Recorded as on the survey?
> Something else?
>
> PS - those who think the fences are off 9 1/2', just say no to math.
Sometimes a fence is a fence. Just because the original fence builder (who evidently didn't have a survey done) shorted himself 9.5 feet doesn't mean someone else, an adjoiner perhaps, is entitled to that property. It depends on what's been happening with this mysterious 9.5 feet over the last 70 years.
We need more information to make a thoroughly educated decision....
Man I hate it when someone moves the Section Corner 9 1/2 feet.
Just put the Section back to the original location. :-O
The community is at peace with the fences the way they are. They have accepted then as marking the original boundary. There is nothing mysterious to the owners, only us surveyors.
I don't file the deeds, I only prepare information for others to insert into them, so not a deed reformation. Hey, if you can correct the record, great, if not, write a M&B to let SOMEONE know that you thought the 9.5' doesn't exist.
>Assuming most if not all surveyors would say the boundary is and always has been >the fence, what next?
>Boundary line agreement?
>Boundary line adjustment?
>Deed correction?
>Measured as, Recorded as on the survey?
>Something else?
If the boundary is, and always has been the same place, why would you need a corrective deed or adjustment, agreement or anything like that? The original conveyance is what it is, and has been findable for over 70 years. You can't change the original record. It is what it is.
I say,
"Measured as, Recorded as on the survey"
This is the same problem/situation as the previous post about a subdivision with "error" in the ORIGINAL monuments.
The original survey as established, recognized, and accepted holds in most cases. If there is any error, it is either in the location of the section corner (nearly 150 years ago there was possibly better knowledge of the original location of the corner) or GASP!! a measurement error, or as you guessed, a misreading/misprinting of the deed distance. In any case, it appears that you have found the boundary. Go have a cold one.
Oh, and unless there is a very compelling reason, leave the written record alone & record your survey.
Dang it! That was my first thought, too.
Thank you, that was the comment I was looking for in this thread. The record v. the measurement is the best way to inform the world that something odd is afoot.
Identify the error as being in the call to the POB as a Record vs. Measured distance on your map.
Recommend that your client file a corrective deed. If they agree, help them get it done and charge accordingly for your services. If they choose not to, you can't force them into it, but it doesn't change where the boundary is.
For the record I did what Brian Allen suggested before the post. I'm in a recording state. Just curious what the response would be.
What happens when they sell?
Since you already did what you did, what did you advise your client to do?
Should the owners still do something to quiet title? (BLA, exchange quiet titles,?)
What happens if they attempt to sell the property at this point?
Wouldn't least one owner (your client) be unable to sign a statutory warranty deed certifying that he is selling the current legal description?
Could the legal description in the deed they sign at sale reflect the newly realized distance? If so, what would the chain of title be for the 9 1/2 foot shift?
Does a recorded survey do all of that for them? Could they simply reference your recorded survey in all future deeds?
Yes, they own the land they occupy in fact, but they do not own it by chain of title yet, it seems. Can one sell something that they OWN but do not have title to?
What happens when they sell?
Since you already did what you did, what did you advise your client to do?
Nothing. The deeds served the purpose for 100 years. Why should my visit change that?
Should the owners still do something to quiet title? (BLA, exchange quiet titles,?)
They shouldn't do anything to cloud title
What happens if they attempt to sell the property at this point?
The same thing that happened last time.
Wouldn't least one owner (your client) be unable to sign a statutory warranty deed certifying that he is selling the current legal description?
See previous answer
> Could the legal description in the deed they sign at sale reflect the newly realized distance?
Not because of anything I did. I did not change the deed.
> Yes, they own the land they occupy in fact, but they do not own it by chain of title yet, it seems. Why not?
