What accuracy do people work to with one man robotic kits?

I've only recently made the shift over to a robot, having always been a conventional too many system like yourself, typically on my own though as until reading your post had thought assistants in the UK where extinct.

I've recently been using the Topcon DS for setting out internal wall and external face work on a new leisure centre, very impressed so far of course some all have there favorite brands.

Accuracy for me would depend on your control and the pole you are using, my set up came with a seco mini point, giving the 360 prism a TH of 170mm or the standard pole TH 1490mm, I've always been brought up to keep the prism as low as possible to minimise one source of error. For that reason I've added smaller poles too, as i found it was a struggle when setting out in excavation or foundations.

For setting cartridge nails, i always drill them with a 4mm masonry bit, then all i have to do is align the head, 90% of the time they are where they are suppose to be, occasionally you will slip on a piece of aggregate but you'll know and compensate when drilling in time.

Accuracy wise, i feel i can set nails to within 1-2mm with the robot, after all the head is 3-4mm itself.

oh, you drill the holes? just with a standard cordless drill?

The guy I work with (and will be replacing) is old school as hell, so its been a battle swapping over anything to non analog stuff. So I've just been smashing away with a masonry nail and a lump hammer for the past 3 years. knowing how others do it is helpful, as I'm not 'sold' on all of his methods being the best way anymore!

With the right equipment in good order and adjustment I don't know why there'd be an accuracy difference between one and two man operations. At least with our leica gear there isn't a difference I could easily detect in the work we usually do.

I'd even venture to say you're looking at more accuracy with a robot. With a conventional instrument you have two sources of possible systemic error on the instrument end: the gun itself and human error. With the robot one of those sources is eliminated. And any instrument error is going to come with fewer variables than human error. Unless your robot is hungover, or maybe hasnt seen the optometrist in a while, or has a naggy wife or got a speeding ticket on the way into work that morning...

Is there any mechanism for marking where the pole is stood on something like concrete when using a larger pole?

I normally use a fine detail pole and just get on one knee to mark, is it much the same as with a robotic one?

edit: basically im just trying to get a grasp of how other gear/how everyone else does it. The only person I've ever had real life contact with who does this sort of thing is the guy who covers for me when I'm on holiday, and the other person I work with. I'm just hoping to get a vague idea of how other people do it differently (especially with one man kits).

i just use a standard bipod. when laying out anything on concrete i'll take a concrete scribe (or 60d nail), and when the point has been established, lightly scribe an "x" outward from the tip of the rod, leaving it in place. then remove the rod, you have an unscribed intersection of an "x" that is maybe 2 mm wide. re-scribe using a straight edge, the point of intersection of your "x" is the point, mark as desired.

> Is there any mechanism for marking where the pole is stood on something like concrete when using a larger pole?
>
> I normally use a fine detail pole and just get on one knee to mark, is it much the same as with a robotic one?
>
> edit: basically im just trying to get a grasp of how other gear/how everyone else does it. The only person I've ever had real life contact with who does this sort of thing is the guy who covers for me when I'm on holiday, and the other person I work with. I'm just hoping to get a vague idea of how other people do it differently (especially with one man kits).

The longer leica prism poles we use have a hardened (tungsten carbide?) tip insert with which you can make a good many scratches on the concrete without quickly grinding them into oblivion or complete bluntness. Or you can just kneel down and pencil mark or paint pen the spot. I don't think there are any great innovations in this area. You can still detach the controller and get down low with a high-accuracy short prism pole when working 1-man.

We have been using one man robotic crews for over ten years. It is the only way to go. Accuracy is better than two or three man crews. Topo or large sites as with hotels or office buildings are a snap. We have performed layout from curb to bridges including anchor bots and deck grades. In the beginning I had a crew check my work for alignment and grade, no problems. The prism pole must be in adjustment.
We have been drilling nails in concrete forever. At times on large tracts we may use two man crew, only because of the back and forth with the traverse.

Get A Battery Powered Drilling Tool

With only one man on the job, you do not want to tire out doing excess grunt work.

You also want a bipod on the rod, so it never gets lain on the ground.

Paul in PA

Get A Battery Powered Drilling Tool

What brand/model of tools do you recommend? Just so I'm not looking at something massively over/underpowered.

Also, when you guys set out curb lines do you always go to back of curb, or do you go to face and let the (groundworkers?) work from there? the co-ords we're provided with are always face (and setting it out offset isnt an issue with the road 2d stuff on the leica tps') but I was just wondering if thats something we have to do just for our guys (who are pretty lazy at times, one of them had me setting out a slabbed garden path recently...) or if thats standard for every job.

Hi,

I am also exploring the use of robotics. Currently using conventional.

For setting out, do you use prism poles? or small nodal prisms to set out during robotics? What kind of accuracy are you able to achieve with what you use to set out?

I would check on the specs of your robot, if you are in tracking mode and staking , the accuracy of a Trimble S6 is rated at 10mm or 5mm for an S3, so it is unlikely you will get down to 1-2mm unless you do you final shot in single shot mode which takes about 5 seconds per reading.

As for placing, 25mm masonary nails in concrete is the way we go, if you hit a stone, dig it out and re place. Its quite easy to get 5mm tolerance like this. Old concrete more than a few weeks is harder and sometimes easier just to drill or mark with a paint pen on background spray paint.

Pin Pole with Robot

I use a seco pin pole and seco stand, for layout/as-builts or anchor bolts. Very easy to carry along with the my robot pole and collector. Pin Pole is only 1/2" dia, with 4 - 1ft sections. I can measure from rod height of 0.2ft to 3.8ft with it.

Pin pole can be seen in this photo near center of image on the steel.

Get A Battery Powered Drilling Tool

Yes i use a standard 20V JCB cordless that was on offer at B&Q a few years ago, main issue for me was two batteries so as i could keep going.

SDS could be a better option but i paid £100.00 for my JCB and an SDS is £300.00 plus i looked at and struggled to get 4mm Masonry bits easily on there own, where as with a standard chuck you can get all manner of size bits.

As for kerb layout, it all depends on the kerb layers, they all have there own way of working, Back of Kerb & Top of Kerb or Face of Kerb & Top of Kerb or Face of Kerb & Water mark. i've done it all over the years, now i favour face of kerb & watermark, that way they have to remove my pins to surface rather than just drive them down.

As accurate as your bubble and patience.

You have the ability to check and re-check very quickly. With that said, you lose the line of sight advantage.

Depending on the level of equipment, you also lose the ability to re-zero as often or check your backsight.

Pin Pole with Robot

leegreen

Your column clamp you make that yourself? If so what are the dimensions am thinking of doing something similar myself, have an old tripod can use the centre thread and arm.

Can you use that on columns or only beams?