Questions for Trimble S3 users

My understanding is that the S3 is not able to use an active target, only the S6. I use an S-6 and have the GPS card to help with the tracking. Great system. I have the TSC2 collector, not the TSC3(latest version). I've heard a few disparaging comments about the TSC3 but it is a little faster.

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> Then we saw a S6 with a trimble data collector. Pretty good on keeping lock, even with the active prism. When the sales rep activated the handhelds low-order GPS, and evidently toggled on the GPS tracking, and then toggled on auto-searching, the system was almost bullet proof!
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I think you mean "even without the active prism"? The GPS search is good isn't it! Works under tree cover better than you would expect as well. Combined with the active prism it really is good at finding you in the bushes.

> When lock was lost, the search function on the instrument found the target faster than I could with a manual total station.
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> I have some questions:
> the LED's along the perimeter of the Trimble Active Prism; those DON'T act as some sort of "homing" beacon?
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When in active tracking mode, the instrument searches for the leds of the active target.
With the multi-track target It also uses them for pointing (need to be careful - if the top row are obstructed for example, the level will be out about 15mm).
There are a few options to configure active tracking, but to be honest there are only a couple of the settings you would actually, use in my opinion.

> I also understood the active prism for the Trimble had some sort of beacon radio transmitter - doesn't this help keep lock?
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no, no radio in the active prism

> and finally - I read somewhere that the S3 could not utilize active tracking, is that true? I think I don't need the S6 onboard display and collector, so the S3 should suffice.
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Active tracking is an option on the S3. There's no "collector" on the S6. The optical plummet is missing on the S3, in the tribrach instead. (so I learnt here the other day).

> Sorry for the rambling, I am getting thoroughly confused by all the different manufacturer jargon and sales-speak.
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> Also - does anyone miss not having clamps on the horizontal and vertical screws?

I used to like them and did miss them. That was some time ago, most of the non-robotic stations I've used for the last 5-10 years have had endless drive screws, so am used to it.

The active track prism - the official name of which is the Multi-Track Target - uses the diode array that rings the top of the prism to assist in acquisition and tracking. The instrument is still tracking the prisms; it only uses the diode to assist and also to ensure that only the desired target is being tracked. When you tell the Trimble instrument to use the Multi-Track with Target ID 3, for instance, it will ONLY track a Multi-Track Target turned to ID 3. If you turn the ID off or to a different number the gun will go into search mode.

This is mainly useful when working around cars, road signs, anything else that a passive tracker might lock onto. But it does increase both the range and the speed of target re-acquisition.

There is no "radio beacon" or anything like that with Trimble robots.

The S3 comes from Trimble with it's radio power turned down; if your dealer does service they should know how to turn it up so that it's the same as an S6.

The Active Tracking and Multi-Track Target add a good bit to the price tag of an S3; depending on your dealer and the trade-in programs that might be available you might want to take a hard look at whether it's worth moving up to an S6. There's more differences than just the lack of a display; your dealer should be able to tell you ALL of the differences, not just the cosmetic ones.

Good luck!

EDIT - Mr. Squowse might know something I don't; I know you need to see the diodes to maintain lock because the gun is looking for the Target ID; I was pretty sure that it was still the prisms that were actually being tracked.

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> I think you mean "even without the active prism"? The GPS search is good isn't it! Works under tree cover better than you would expect as well. Combined with the active prism it really is good at finding you in the bushes.
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Yep, I did mean "even without the active prism" 🙂

Thanks for the response, things are getting clearer to me.

Craig

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> EDIT - Mr. Squowse might know something I don't; I know you need to see the diodes to maintain lock because the gun is looking for the Target ID; I was pretty sure that it was still the prisms that were actually being tracked.

I saw a similar thread on this exact topic a while back, but of course I wasn't paying attention. +o( I look forward to RTFM as soon as we get the gun, we are going to demo one for a week. (A Trimble S3, or maybe an S6 now that I see there is NOT an optical plumet in the S3. Actually - I was a little disappointed to learn from the sales rep that there was no Laser Plumet on the S6.)

thanks for your thoughts!

If there was a thousand or something in it I would get the S3 (with active tracking) and use a separate optical plummet. Could probably find somewhere to keep it in the box.

> EDIT - Mr. Squowse might know something I don't; I know you need to see the diodes to maintain lock because the gun is looking for the Target ID; I was pretty sure that it was still the prisms that were actually being tracked.

It will track with the prisms covered. No distance can be measured though.

Obscuring part of the led array will change the pointing. Vertical is the worst - about 14mm potentially. Side to side you can get about 10mm in worst case scenario.

On the plus side - Because the LED array is being tracked, in active mode the pointing error as you revolve the target is (virtually) zero. If you switch it to passive mode you will get pointing errors of about 4-5mm (from memory) as you revolve the target and the instrument flicks from one prism to the next.

I have tested and discovered all of the above myself.

I did also test for the influence of adjacent retro-reflective clothing/shiny surfaces on the tracking of the LED array (read bad reports on this forum of this). I could not reproduce these effects. I think it could just be possible though.

One of our dealers told me he had been over to Germany and saw the calibration machine for these targets. It cost a fortune apparently to custom build it. All of the LEDs in the targets are precisely adjusted for brightness. Goes a small way to justify the cost I suppose.

I have two S6 robots. I just bought my second one back in February and I considered an S3 too. I do primarily wooded work and the S6 is awesome. I also do a fair amount along roads, so I decided to pay the $7 large for the S6.

Something I think is cool about the TSC3 with GPS is you can recon a job with the data collector alone. It is nice for walking the boundary and setting up traverse.

Thanks much Squowse.