International Feet

Switching from US to international feet

Welcome to the 0.3048 club.

You actually switched to the foot.

on December 31, 2022. After that date, the “U.S. survey foot” will be superseded by the “foot” (formerly known as the “international foot”)

For issues with feet, a podiatrist or chiropodist is recommended.  

If we changed the name of the unit to "Mendenhall Foot" perhaps people would have less trouble letting go of it.  

Make sure if you have to do this and coordinates are published on something like state plane or utm. You have meta data note. Here its a 25 ft shift.  Roughly.  Even NGS sais to stick with the way it was designed to be . I think even they understand numbers that look alike in northing and easting  could be confusing lol.   .3048 EXACT.  Vs 1200/3937.  

You actually switched to the foot.

on December 31, 2022. After that date, the “U.S. survey foot” will be superseded by the “foot” (formerly known as the “international foot”)

Since we went to a foot, why didnt we just go to meters. I know why carpenters dont, but all our software and equipment is in meters and is converted to feet. So...

If this is a project in NAD 83 (2011) and it's in a state that is legislatively defined by the U.S. Survey Foot then it should still be in USSF.  The change only applies to SPCs in the new datum when that's released in 2025.  If they still insist PLEASE make sure that's noted in the metadata.

Since we went to a foot, why didnt we just go to meters

It was tried in the 90s. 

There is talk that the state is legislatively defined as US survey feet for NAD83. I'd like to see that statute, from my reading of it, the statute is silent on the subject, not defining it as US feet or international feet. 

I haven't researched other states, but wonder if they're similar. 

And PLEASE isn't enough, you'll have to say PRETTY PLEASE.

@mightymoe Here's one from Michigan if you're interested.

@lurker 

That one is plainly stated. International Feet in Michigan. 

@norm 

Yep, the great meter conversion fiasco. I was a big advocate of it, changed my mind by the time it was finally pulled. Learned what the term FUBAR really means firsthand. 

@mightymoe Here is some info from Colorado.

(1) The plane coordinate values for a point on the earth's surface, used to express the geographic position or location of such point in the appropriate zone of this system, shall consist of two distances expressed in United States survey feet and decimals of a foot when using the Colorado coordinate system of 1927. One of these distances, to be known as the x-coordinate, shall give the position in an east-west direction; the other, to be known as the y-coordinate, shall give the position in a north-south direction. These coordinates shall be made to depend upon and conform to plane rectangular coordinate values for the monumented points of the North American horizontal geodetic control network as published by the national ocean survey/national geodetic survey (formerly the United States coast and geodetic survey), or its successors, and the plane coordinates of which have been computed on the systems defined in this article. Any such station may be used for establishing a survey connection to either Colorado coordinate system.

(2) For the purposes of converting coordinates of the Colorado coordinate system of 1983 from meters to feet, the U.S. Survey Foot shall be used. The conversion factor is: One meter equals 3937/1200 feet.

@mightymoe I remember mid to late 90’s Laying out a road in Colorado. Our requirement was to stake and mark stakes in meters.  The earth work contractors squashed that very quickly.  So they tried the whole just mark the cut fills stationing in feet but everything else all our files meters. That didn’t last long either lol . I wore out my hp 32 converting everything on every shot. 3.2808333333333 just implanted in my brain to this day. I was allergic to .3048 exact. As I have always used us ft accept a few cases and meters.

34-25-101. System of plane coordinates adopted; zones.

(a) The system of plane coordinates which has been established by the office of National Geodetic Survey, or its successors, for defining and stating the positions or locations of points on the surface of the earth within the state of Wyoming is adopted and hereafter shall be known and designated as the "Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983."

(b) For the purpose of the use of this system, the state is divided into an East Zone, an East Central Zone, a West Central Zone and a West Zone:

(i) As established for use in the East Zone, the Wyoming Coordinate System shall be named, and in any land description in which it is used it shall be designated, the "Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, East Zone." The following counties will use Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, East Zone: Laramie, Albany, Platte, Niobrara, Converse, Weston, Crook, Campbell, and Goshen;

(ii) As established for use in the East Central Zone, the Wyoming Coordinate System shall be named, and in any land description in which it is used it shall be designated, the "Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, East Central Zone." The following counties will use Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, East Central Zone: Carbon, Natrona, Johnson, Sheridan, Washakie, and Big Horn;

(iii) As established for use in the West Central Zone, the Wyoming Coordinate System shall be named, and in any land description in which it is used it shall be designated, the "Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, West Central Zone." The following counties will use Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, West Central Zone: Sweetwater, Fremont, Hot Springs, and Park;

(iv) As established for use in the West Zone, the Wyoming Coordinate System shall be named, and in any land description in which it is used it shall be designated, the "Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, West Zone." The following counties will use Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, West Zone: Uinta, Lincoln, Sublette, and Teton; also Yellowstone National Park.

34-25-102. Designation of coordinates.

The plane coordinates of a point on the earth's surface, to be used in expressing the position or location of such point in the appropriate zone of this system, shall consist of two (2) linear distances, expressed in meters to the nearest millimeter. One (1) of these distances, to be known as the "x-coordinate" or "east-coordinate," shall give the position in an east-and-west direction; the other, to be known as the "y-coordinate" or "north-coordinate," shall give the position in a north-and-south direction. These coordinates shall depend upon and conform to the coordinates, on the Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983 of the National Geodetic Survey, or its successors, within the state of Wyoming, as those coordinates have been determined by the survey.

34-25-103. Land extending into a second zone.

When any tract of land to be defined by a single description extends from one into a second of the coordinate zones specified in W.S. 34-25-101, the positions of all the points on its boundaries may be referred to either of the two (2) zones, and the zone which is used shall be specifically named in the description.

34-25-104. Definition of zones; horizontal control stations.

(a) For purposes of more precisely defining the Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983 the following definition of the zones is adopted:

(i) The Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, East Zone, is a transverse Mercator projection of the North American Datum of 1983, having a central meridian at 105 10' West of Greenwich on which meridian the scale is set at one part in 16,000 exactly. The origin of coordinates is at the intersection of the parallel at 40 30' North Latitude and the meridian at 105 10' West of Greenwich. This origin is given the coordinates: x=200,000 meters and y=0 meters;

(ii) The Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, East Central Zone, is a transverse Mercator projection of the North American Datum of 1983, having a central meridian at 107 20' West of Greenwich on which meridian the scale is set at one part in 16,000 exactly. The origin of coordinates is at the intersection of the parallel at 40 30' North Latitude and the meridian at 107 20' West of Greenwich. This origin is given the coordinates: x=400,000 meters and y=100,000 meters;

(iii) The Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, West Central Zone, is a transverse Mercator projection of the North American Datum of 1983, having a central meridian at 108 45' West of Greenwich on which meridian the scale is set at one part in 16,000 exactly. The origin of coordinates is at the intersection of the parallel at 40 30' North Latitude and the meridian at 108 45' West of Greenwich. This origin is given the coordinates: x=600,000 meters and y=0 meters;

(iv) The Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, West Zone, is a transverse Mercator projection of the North American Datum of 1983, having a central meridian at 110 05' West of Greenwich on which meridian the scale is set at one part in 16,000 exactly. The origin of coordinates is at the intersection of the parallel at 40 30' North Latitude and the meridian at 110 05' West of Greenwich. This origin is given the coordinates: x=800,000 meters and y=100,000 meters.

(b) The position of any survey control point in the Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983 shall be as marked on the ground by horizontal control stations established in conformity with standards adopted by the Federal Geodetic Control Committee, or its successors, using first-order, second-order or higher-order accuracy survey work, whose geodetic positions have been rigorously adjusted on the North American Datum of 1983 and whose coordinates have been computed on the system herein defined. Any such station may be used for establishing a connection with the Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983.

34-25-105. Recording coordinates; use of satellite survey techniques.

No coordinates based on the Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983, purporting to define the position of a point on a land boundary, shall be presented to be recorded in any public land records or deed records in the office of a county clerk unless a record and report of survey of the actual survey to establish the plane coordinates of the point has been filed with the county surveyor, the county engineer or the county clerk and in conformity with the standards prescribed in W.S. 34-25-104. When acceptable satellite survey techniques are employed, a minimum of two (2) independent observing sessions shall be executed and shall agree to not less than one (1) part in one hundred thousand (100,000) of the distance between the points. The procedures and results shall conform with the standards in W.S. 34-25-104.

34-25-106. Reference to system on maps.

The use of the term "Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983" on any map, report of survey or other document, shall be limited to plane coordinates based on the Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983 as defined in this chapter.

34-25-107. Description in other surveys; conflicts.

Wherever coordinates based on the Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983 are used to describe any tract of land which in the same document is also described by reference to any subdivision, line or corner of the United States public land surveys, the description by plane coordinates shall be construed as supplemental to the basic description of such subdivision, line or corner contained in the official plats and field notes filed of record, and in the event of any conflict the description by reference to the subdivision, line or corner of the United States public land surveys shall prevail over the description by plane coordinates. Every recorded map, survey or conveyance, or other instrument affecting title to real property which delineates, describes or refers to such property or any part thereof by reference to coordinates based upon the Wyoming Coordinate System NAD 1983 shall also describe the property by reference and tie to a controlling corner monument of the United States public land surveys, if applicable.

34-25-108. Application.

Nothing contained in this chapter shall require any purchaser or mortgagee to rely on a description, any part of which 

@olemanriver 

I remember some of those numbers, 1609.34, 804.67, 18.28, 10.06, they tend to stick especially 804.67, I used that thing so many times. 

Since Wyoming was ambiguous about US vs International feet. This was published in the federal register.

https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2007/03/05/07-990/publication-of-north-american-datum-of-1983-state-plane-coordinates-in-feet-in-wyoming

@lurker 

Yes, they publish values in US Feet, however, it's not statutory. So,,,,,,,,,, here we are today.

No big deal for me, these projects are hyper controlled anyway, we will be locating all the control today and figure out how "good" it is internally. I suspect it will all be less than .02' using RTK.

Thanks for the info Lurker!!!

@mightymoe yeah I think i got ptsd from running the gun trying line a crew chief in meters until i just said the heck with it told him left right in feet and half pole and a hair smidgen. And when i was on the other end and was told cut .6 trying to guess about how much that was. I did get use to meters in usmc. But i had surveyed so long in feet I always thought in that way. Even doing orbital comps. I still had to visualize in feet and tenths and hundreths thousandth of a foot. I mean i am just stuck in my ways i reckon.