Excellent story! ?ÿ https://www.xyht.com/surveying/the-forever-chainman/
?ÿ ?ÿI knew a couple over the years. ???
When I was the head of the surveying department for an engineering company I had a forever chainman who worked for me.?ÿ Jack retired when he was 82, not voluntarily.?ÿ His vision was bad and he couldn't hear well.?ÿ We did so much work along roads and highways that I was always afraid he was going to step out into traffic that he couldn't see or hear.?ÿ The president of the company told Jack that he was moving him into the office to assist us there.?ÿ NOPE.?ÿ If I can't work on the survey crew then I retire.?ÿ
Jack may have been a forever rodman but I know of at least 5 men who learned from Jack and went on to be licensed.?ÿ All of whom gave credit to Jack for what he taught them.
Jack told me one time that he had had two jobs.?ÿ Welker and Associates and World War II.
RIP George (Jack) Dobbins.
One, nope Two stand out in my memory.
Both were the best of the best. They are both missed, and I have lost all means of contact. Sorry about that.
Today, the chainman position is often not needed. Times change.
?ÿI have lost all means of contact
In today's internet world finding someone is much easier or more likely than it used to be.
Between Facebook, address searches (which have gotten much stingier with what they give free), obituaries (often for parents of the party of interest), property records, and mentions in newspaper stories, there is lots of info.
My brother recently mentioned that he had tracked down all but two of the ~40 members of his elementary school class of 1963 using such resources. This was in small-town USA, of course, but not as static as the community Holy Cow describes, and few are still in that county.
I will have you know that since 1980, when Ivan died, I am the sole surviving member of my Second Grade class.?ÿ The two of us were the entire class.
And, you are correct, Bill.?ÿ Tracking people down today is incredibly easy compared to in?ÿ the past.
well, the First "forever chainman" dates back to 1975... and his Name is list from memory forever.
The second, I have definitely tried finding her, several times. My last contact with her dates back to 1996. The company we worked for got absorbed into another more than a decade ago. Her parents have passed on, and even visiting their home and asking the neighbors a few years ago was not fruitful.
Perhaps were will be reunited on the other side.
Thanks, I enjoyed the story.?ÿ
I remember a "forever chainman" I worked with back in the '70s named Chester.?ÿ Although Chester was older than most of us he was really good help and a friendly chap.?ÿ He seemed to know everything about what we were doing but never had any desire to run the gun or supervise a crew.?ÿ?ÿ
After Chester retired in about '78 I was told his 'story'.?ÿ Chester was an engineer and a fraternity brother of the engineer that owned the outfit where we worked.?ÿ Chester had been successful in the petroleum industry until a bout with alcoholism and a stint in a mental facility left him divorced, unemployed and broke.?ÿ He wound up as a field hand.
We really missed Chester when he retired.?ÿ For a couple of years he would still stop by the office and even came to a few Christmas office parties.?ÿ Haven't thought about him for years.?ÿ ?ÿ
Excellent story! ?ÿ https://www.xyht.com/surveying/the-forever-chainman/
?ÿ ?ÿI knew a couple over the years. ???
Thank you for sharing this here. I really enjoyed writing it, as I do most of my "Field Notes" installments. Frank not only worked his behind off all day, he often wouldn't go to dinner with us at night because he would go for a 5-10 mile run. He ate garlic by the handful, for health reasons, which made it tough to ride in a truck with him after a long hot day in the field.
I am pleased you all are sharing your "Forever Chainman" stories here.
a tiny bit off topic:
"Employers must demand and reward licensure. Set minimum hiring standards that includes an LSIT or an LSIT in the first few years and a PLS once the experience has been acquired. The employers must have the personal security to hire people smarter than themselves. Hire folks with an education in anything ?? like most baristas at Starbucks. Critical thinking, reading, writing and arithmetic education is quite common now. As the profession no longer supports the single function draftsman, the profession no longer has room for unlicensed folks and especially, the unlicensed folks that will never be capable of licensure. The fork in the road is those sitting for and capable of passing their LSIT and those that will necessarily become unemployed. Land surveying is not a corporate welfare program."
this is clipped out of context:
please read the entire post (and the thread) to understand the mindset of the author, and his brothers.
start here, under the sub header The Solution
http://clsaforum.californiasurveyors.org/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8449&start=25#p51585
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I, personally, disagree.
I do respect the author, but in this matter I think he is way off base.
California is the most highly regulated state in the union. Not always a Good Thing
?ÿCritical thinking, ... education is quite common now.
I have my doubts about the level of critical thinking in our population and how well it is taught.
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I have a young man that could be a good party chief...but truth is he needs a forever chainman to keep him going. I had one for my first year or so. He was an alcoholic, and awful slow sometimes, but he pointed out when I was about to make a big mistake. He just wasn't up for dealing with the office, dealing with the public, dealing with the contractors, dealing with making decisions, etc, and he wanted to be able to call in on Mondays if the headache was too harsh. I am pretty sure he could have passed any test (LSIT, PLS, probably engineering), while drunk.
A couple more things about Jack.?ÿ He wasn't fast but he stayed moving all day.?ÿ He could cut live all day.
He also had a quiet, dry sense of humor.?ÿ We pretty much shut down the office for the funeral of an ex-employee so everyone could attend.?ÿ Jack brought his wife, which was unusual because many of us had never met her.?ÿ When someone asked him about bringing her his reply was: "I had to bring her.?ÿ If I didn't I'd have had to kiss her goodbye".?ÿ?ÿ
When Jack retired we had a small ceremony for him.?ÿ They gave him the keys and title to an old company car and you'd have thought they gave him a million dollars.?ÿ They went back through as much of the time records that they could and made some estimates for the years before those.?ÿ They gave him a check for $.01 for every hour that he had worked for Welker.?ÿ I don't remember the exact amount but it was somewhere north of $1200.00.
I dont think there are many opportunities to be like Chester anymore. Making a career out of working on a survey field?ÿ crew , and being able to retire at some point is an idea that has mostly died out, along with countless other ways to make good livings without a post secondary education.?ÿ
We have allowed ourselves to be modernized to the point that the grunt work is expected to fall on the shoulders of the "professional" instead of on someone who would be happy to have the job.?ÿ When I took my first job out of college I had a secretary to handle all of my typing.?ÿ I had a dictation machine with a magnetic tape.?ÿ She would listen to my tape and type out what I said, including the inserted punctuation I would add.?ÿ Is there anyone anywhere using that method today??ÿ I spend a ridiculous amount of time at a keyboard and, of course, type all of my own products.
Similarly, I do 99 percent of my own drafting.?ÿ I hate drafting.?ÿ But, I do not have enough of it to justify paying someone else.
Without the "chainman" type employee, that means a ton of other little things get done by me just to be ready to roll.
I am the one who chose to operate my business in this manner, so I can't blame anyone else.?ÿ The bottom line is that too much of my time gets spent on work that someone else could do if they were as multitalented as I am.?ÿ Thus, not enough time is spent on those things that truly require the specialized training and experience I have accumulated.
I think some of that is good. For example, dictating and typing is inefficient. I think it is good that the value of labor is too high for the incremental time savings of not typing your own communications to be a winning proposition. Think of all the productive work being preformed by people who would have been secretaries in the past.
When you are on your own it is often hard to justify adding only one more employee. You don't have enough "assistant" work to keep someone busy full time. You would have to add more than one person to keep everybody busy. Working alone is less efficient, but there are less capitalistic benefits that can make up for it.?ÿ
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I can remember several that were excellent field crew material and knew what was next without being told and they were ready all day long for whatever came next.
The other group of forever chainmen group is that bunch of know it alls that just won't take that next step and move into any position that requires them to take on any form of responsibility and decision making at all.