Big money in Colorado ?

When it sounds too good to be true.........................

From the wording, I'll guess that pay rate is for the crew. So let's say full-time two-person crew at 125,000 to 250,000 per annum. That requires at least some office support (which you provide, I assume). Plus you provide your own instruments, software, vehicle, other gear, and e&o, general liability, and worker's comp. So that means we're talking routine wages in a volatile market segment with a single client. Not so hot, really.

> When it sounds too good to be true.........................

Exacta! Er- exactly!

Don't speak about or judge things you know nothing about. I work for a company in Texas that has a similar business model. I own my own equipment and vehicle and employ one Rodman. I profited about 80k after all expenses. Now, I don't know about this particular company, but there are others I know about that work just like this.

I forgot to mention that the potential to earn more is there. Depends how hard you want to work. I will profit more money this year since I won't be spending on equipment again. Have a goal of 100k profit. Not bad for a party chief eh!

Hey ScaledStatePlane, How would an unlicensed even qualify for E&O ??

> Hey ScaledStatePlane, How would an unlicensed even qualify for E&O ??

The E&O falls on the contracting company, not on the field crew.

You'll see this business model become the norm in the coming decade.

is this legal in your state? It's not where I am.

Is this legal in your state? In Florida, a party chief or survey crew can't sub-contract themselves out without being directly employed by a licensed surveyor or are licensed themselves.

there are a few firms(that I know of) in San Antonio that follow this business practice. problem is, I feel, is that the crew is probably slamming 6-8 lot surveys in a day, send their data and sketches back to the "office".
what is produced is a drawing with bearings and distances that match the recorded subdivision plat EXACTLY, showing calculated ties to the "real corner" from fence posts that were located.
I have come in behind some of these "surveys" and have found iron rods, down .1-.2 tenths, near the fence corners. wham-bam surveys.
and yes I have forwarded these surveys to the board - its bullsh*t
my wife is a closer at a title company and sees them all the time. all for $275+tax.

I recently followed one where we are platting a portion of a downtown block that'll end up being seriously vertical when it's all said and done. Very dense urban property encumbered by myriad easements, license agreements, utilities, restrictions, etc. Client was nearly apoplectic at the fee, said "you've aready got our title survey- and it was only 900 bucks three months ago." ONE found corner. Record bearings. Missing easements. No ties to centerline or adjoiners. Incorrect and/or outdated conveyance info. This is on a fraction of an acre that is worth in the tens of millions.

I called the guy who signed it (in Cleveland) and politely asked for any info he had and to set the corners he called (not sure why- they were wrong anyways). "His" crew came back out 2 days later and drove a few 3/8 rods to refusal by limestone (about half a foot).

I've got no problem with guys figuring out how to do a little better job of making some money- but I don't think most of us posting here keep surveying in order to get rich.

> I forgot to mention that the potential to earn more is there. Depends how hard you want to work. I will profit more money this year since I won't be spending on equipment again. Have a goal of 100k profit. Not bad for a party chief eh!

Contract or listed as an employee?

Contract, unless registered as a RPLS in Texas, is a violation.B-)

It's the same way in Florida. A party chief or crew can't offer surveying services without either being licensed themselves or under the direct employment of a licensed surveyor.

> my wife is a closer at a title company and sees them all the time. all for $275+tax.

So if the bill on the closing statement is $275, then the contract crew is making less per 'survey'. Let's guess they are paid even as much as about half or $140 per 'survey'.

The fellow up above claims he made $80,000 in profit (?gross or net?). For me (being overly generous with profit margins and thinking of overhead expenses such as the pay and benefits for the hired rodman, insurances, etc...), that would mean billing out at least $240,000/yr.

$240,000 / $140 = 1714.29 'surveys' per year. If I worked every single day of the year, it would be necessary to survey about 5 properties each and every day.

If we get real crazy and think the hiring company is using the walmart model of business and only makes $25/survey and pays the contract crew $250/survey. That still works out to 2.6 surveys I would have to conduct every single day of the year.

Either option just does not seem feasible to me. I must be missing something or there are some shortcuts going on to crank out that many surveys a day.

Then, as pointed out above, how many states is this a violation of the standards of practice?

In Kentucky, an employee is defined in part as "...and includes professional and technical support personnel contracted on a temporary or occasional basis..." I do not think being a full time contract crew should be considered as a temporary or occasional basis. As I understand it, that language is in there mainly in case a licensee wants to sub another licensee's crew for a project.

Then from the hiring company's view point - who is taking supervisory control of projects that they are not visiting? I am very certain that I ran into a case of this several years ago. When I found a complete F-up in his work, the licensee who stamped the drawing kept passing me off to some crew guy who had apparently been in 'charge' of the work.

Federal Highway Administration (FHWA) is hiring for their Denver area office if any one is interested...

I think what is likely being discussed is layout work- dropping, for instance, 25 house slabs in at a time. The rate at which houses are going up around here is no less staggering than it's been for 20 years now. And it's work that wouldn't be bad for the bottom line. You get a cad file with a whole subdivision wodrh of slabs, calc it up, ship it off to "your" crew, and they go mow em down at 100 or 150 a pop. Often off of a single setup.

Employee WITH benefits.

I do mainly large acreage tracts and construction as they pay more. The less experienced chiefs are the ones doing the small cracker tittle surveys, they don't make as much. I don't what to say guys, we turn in the work and after that it's the RPLS job to decide what good and what's not. I'm sometimes sent to collect more info on those cracker jobs so that makes me think/hope that they are not turning in bogus work. I take pride in my work and I'm close to getting my RPLS so I'm not out there half assing my work. I can't say the same for others though as I don't know them and I don't ever see them.

I spent over 20k of my own money just to get this job but it was worth it. The owner is an insanely generous person. I love working for him. We even get a bonus at the end of the year.

I have to add that I've been surveying for ten years and I've worked for many companies. Some doing nothing but titles to well known engineering companies doing large projects and even some TXdot work. I feel this company puts in more time and research than other companies I've worked for. They aren't afraid to send your work back and have you collect more data to resolve the boundary. There may be other companies that are doing terrible work,I don't doubt that. Just don't put them all in the same boat because they are taking your business.

I've been surveying for ten years and I've worked for many companies. Some doing nothing but titles to well known engineering companies doing large projects and even some TXdot work. I feel this company puts in more time and research than other companies I've worked for. They aren't afraid to send your work back and have you collect more data to resolve the boundary. There may be other companies that are doing terrible work,I don't doubt that. Just don't put them all in the same boat because they are taking your business.

If you get your RPLS license would you feel comfortable and confident in signing the boundary surveys for every crew that is working for your company? I have never seen a title survey factory company put out constant and consistent quality work. You may be the best party chief at your company, however your reputation will be that of the worst party chief at your company.

> ...however your reputation will be that of the worst party chief at your company.

I would fall short of grading someone I hadn't met or wasn't familiar with their work. No doubt he's a disciplined field hand.

But I'm pretty sure that if burn_31 was capable of licensure he would be by now. It's apparent that it is money that is the driving force in his employment status. There is nothing wrong that. When I was an employee the monetary consideration was always up there on the list of hierarchy.

However professionalism is something that eludes a lot of folks in this business. I am a professional and operate as one. I also realize there are plenty of folks in the surveying business that aren't professionals and probably never will be. There's plenty of surveying to go around. Live and let die I've always said. B-)