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ALTA Record Description Revision per Attorney

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armichael
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@rover83 thank you for the good advice. I guess the tricky part for me was how to handle the attorney while producing a quality product for all parties. Let me ask you a follow up question- do you personally show the record AND newly prepared descriptions on your ALTAs in such a case?


 
Posted : July 23, 2021 2:59 am
armichael
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@fairbanksls if that helps me get over 4 hours of sleep Iƒ??ll start writing them every night before bed!


 
Posted : July 23, 2021 3:02 am
jitterboogie
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@armichael?ÿ

Try some valerian root and chamomile tea.

Add favorite EtOH as necessary if results aren't satisfactory.... ???? ?????ÿ


 
Posted : July 23, 2021 7:51 am
rover83
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@armichael?ÿ

Yes, I would show both on the same sheet. I will label them "Record Description" (citing the title commitment number & date) and "New Description". For the latter, I will put my statement about why a new one was prepared before the actual description. Should be pretty clear to most reviewers.


 
Posted : July 23, 2021 7:59 am
john-putnam
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@armichael?ÿ

Okay, this is a pretty common situation.?ÿ When additional right-of-way is dedicated, it is unusual that new deeds for the grantor's property are recorded.?ÿ Only when some action requires a new recording would the description be revised to include the exception.

You are not adding a line to the end of the 'recorded description', you are adding a line in the legal description for a future recorded document that describes the current configuration of the property.


 
Posted : July 23, 2021 9:11 am

holy-cow
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@john-putnam?ÿ

We run across this a lot as the owner's deed description is pulled from when they acquired the property.?ÿ Later conveyances of small tracts, quite naturally, will not be shown on the parent deed unless re-recorded for some reason to show those cutouts.?ÿ Sometimes the parent deed description has been used in a later conveyance and no one really notices that the grantee isn't really getting what it says.


 
Posted : July 23, 2021 10:15 am
john-putnam
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@holy-cow?ÿ

I'm currently working on 2 miles of rail and street right-of-way in an industrial area for the DOT and UPR.?ÿ Of the four roads intersection on the project, two properties have apparently have transferred additional R/w which does not show up on the vesting deeds.

This job has a nice little bonus that the frontage road falls entirely within the railroads right-of-way and the current valuation map does not show any agreements between the local jurisdiction and the UPR.?ÿ It will be fun to find that.?ÿ


 
Posted : July 23, 2021 2:45 pm
BStrand
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Posted by: @armichael

I noted on the survey that the description does not take into account said widening deeds.

I think as long as you showed the current description and the pieces that have been carved off then you've done everything you need to do.?ÿ I don't know that I would have made the comment above though because to me that's an interpretation that should be left up to the user of the survey.


 
Posted : July 23, 2021 4:30 pm
dmyhill
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@la-stevens?ÿ

2021 Minimum Standards:

4. Records Research -

...In order to complete an ALTA/NSPS Land Title Survey, the surveyor must be provided with the following:

A. The current record description of the real property to be surveyed or, in the case of an original survey prepared for purposes of locating and describing real property that has not been previously separately described in documents conveying an interest in the real property, the current record description of the parent parcel that contains the property to be surveyed;

6. Plat or Map

B. Boundary, Descriptions, Dimensions, and Closures
i. (a) The current record description of the surveyed property, or
(b) In the case of an original survey, the current record document number of the parent tract that contains the surveyed property.
ii. Any new description of the surveyed property that was prepared in conjunction with the survey, including a statement explaining why the new description was prepared. Except in the case of an original survey, preparation of a new description should be avoided unless deemed necessary or appropriate by the surveyor and insurer. Preparation of a new description should also generally be avoided when the record description is a lot or block in a platted, recorded subdivision. Except in the case of an original survey, if a new description is prepared, a note must be provided stating (a) that the new description describes the same real estate as the record description or, (b) if it does not, how the new description differs from the record description.


 
Posted : July 26, 2021 12:45 pm
dmyhill
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Posted by: @dmyhill

a note must be provided stating (a) that the new description describes the same real estate as the record description or, (b) if it does not, how the new description differs from the record description.

Turns out the standards provide guidance on this specific question.


 
Posted : July 26, 2021 12:47 pm

ppm
 ppm
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I read most of the thread, but not all so I am not sure if this was mentioned...

?ÿ

First an excerpt from 6.B.II "...Except in the case of an original survey, preparation of a new description should be avoided unless deemed necessary or appropriate by the surveyor and insurer..."

?ÿ

Tell the attorney to get the insurer on board and then it can be done. That attorney should not hassle you anymore until the title company is willing to revise the description.

?ÿ

And if the title company does not come around, then just like most have said show the Fee ROW on the map, and maybe make a note in your Land Area portion that it includes or excludes this ROW.?ÿ


 
Posted : July 28, 2021 11:35 am
vasurvey3004
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Out of curiosity did the title company take exception to the ROW in the B-II exceptions?


 
Posted : July 28, 2021 10:47 pm
vasurvey3004
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@armichael I recently had a similar situation.?ÿ I depicted the record description "a lot and block subdivision description" , wrote a metes&bounds with being a part of clause and "see note x" and wrote a note in regards to the new description with a reference to the B-II exception.

?ÿ


 
Posted : August 4, 2021 7:20 pm
vasurvey3004
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@jph that's why you can charge the BIG BUCKS


 
Posted : August 4, 2021 10:43 pm
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