Sits down and says...I need some advice and pep talk??
I am finding myself losing my enthusiasm??I am feeling beat down. And frankly, I feel like I have been a crappy Father lately. I come home from work tired, exhausted, and just drained. I've missed baseball games, dinners, family events...
How do all of you guys deal with the constant workload, poison ivy, bug bites, travel, deadlines, etc.? This is a tough Profession.
Yes, I'll have another round please...
I heard someone say that your greatest commitment should be to the people that will cry at your funeral. From personal experience, today's feelings of failure will later become regrets. Sometimes good things are not the best thing. The only answer is to prioritize. A person that I respect said a Man's order of priorities should be:
1. God
2. Family
3. Country
4. Work
Now that I am on the back end of my career, I belive he was correct. Some of the projects that I worked on long and hard are being torn down and redeveloped. Of all things, I am most proud of my Children.
Amen, bro.
I am finding myself losing my enthusiasm??I am feeling beat down. And frankly, I feel like I have been a crappy Father lately. I come home from work tired, exhausted, and just drained. I've missed baseball games, dinners, family events...
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My advice would be to STAY OUT OF THE BAR!?ÿ ??ÿ
A lot of what you describe can be corporate culture driven.
I've worked at firms where the licensed professionals were expected to work 50+ hours a week, where taking vacations was a waste of time because you had to work so much more the week before and after that the week off was superfluous, where when I cut back to 40 a week after heart surgery in September they laid me off in November because my billable time was down.?ÿI've also worked places where they insisted you took your vacations regularly, realized that after 40 hours a week your productivity drops, and had 50% utilization rate goals for managers.?ÿ ?ÿ
Hang around our profession long enough and you hear all?ÿ the "you have to do it because you love it, it's a way of life, I'm going to work until I'm 89 and die with my plumb bob on" crap.?ÿ And, with all due respect, that's what is it...crap.?ÿ Over the last decade I've been in the hospital twice for serious stuff, like "I really should have my will prepared" stuff (heart attack and internal bleeding requiring transfusions and emergency surgery).?ÿ I came out of those experiences with the attitude that?ÿ?ÿlmbrls expressed above (though I'd add friends and community between #2 & #3).?ÿ I don't' have any kids, but my father was a workaholic and I can guarantee that when you're gone your kids aren't going to be reminiscing about that time you worked all night to get those townhouse plats submitted. Guaran-f@#$ing-?ÿtee.
One thing I did after the recession (when I discovered the hard way that no matter how much of a survey expert you were, how much case law you could quote, etc. that it wouldn't help you keep a job in a downturn), and this will be "Beer Leg Blasphemy", was make a conscious ?ÿdecision to embrace the?ÿmanagement rather than operations side of surveying.?ÿ Dealing with both the stress of?ÿproject management, and the "joys" of field work just wasn't for me at this point in my life.?ÿ IMHO you can excel at one or the other, and still have a?ÿpersonal life, ?ÿbut trying to balance both is a recipe for what you're experiencing right now.?ÿ
Just me, but I get?ÿa greater?ÿsense of professional ?ÿsatisfaction at 54 being in a position where the Senior VP of a firm says, when you say you might work from home because of the weather forecast for snow tomorrow, "Don't worry, senior guys don't have to come in on days like that"?ÿ and being able to spend a couple of weeks in Europe and a couple of weeks in the Caribbean each year then I get burning the midnight oil solving a complicated boundary?ÿ (like I said,?ÿ blasphemy).?ÿ
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There ain't no such thing as a "life and death" survey.
One thing I still can't grasp is surveyors being booked up for weeks or months in advance and still charging stupid low?ÿprices for their professional services.?ÿ?ÿ?ÿ
Double your prices and work half as much.?ÿ
The time spent with your loved ones should be worth more than?ÿdoing cheap surveys.
A man's first priority is to take care of his family.
For me that means hands on, at home as much as I can.
You get one shot at it with kids, everything is once, so be there.
Right now I'm figuring out how to involve a 4 year old boy in helping me with projects at home.?ÿ He helped me move some rocks from a walkway (a previous owner DIY flat rock walk that wasn't done right) to build a little dry laid rock curb in another spot.?ÿ He dropped one on his hand, cried a little but the coolness of helping Grandpa move rocks soon overcame that LOL.
??I am finding myself losing my enthusiasm??I am feeling beat down. .....How do all of you guys deal with the constant workload, poison ivy, bug bites, travel, deadlines, etc.? This is a tough Profession.
Sounds to me like it might be time for a change of venue. My guess is that it isn't the profession, it's the way it is practiced at your current place of business.
Lots of great feedback here, and good insight from the folks that have sat in the seat I am in now.?ÿ
It's very true on how hard it is to balance the office/field in a corporate setting. I am still young enough to be able and I want to be in the field, but I am also the one that handles all the department stuff. Only so many hours in the day.?ÿ
Lots of great feedback here, and good insight from the folks that have sat in the seat I am in now.?ÿ
It's very true on how hard it is to balance the office/field in a corporate setting. I am still young enough to be able and I want to be in the field, but I am also the one that handles all the department stuff. Only so many hours in the day.?ÿ
Like I said, everyone's different; but I was surprised how rewarding it was when I stopped doing a lot of the fieldwork and saw my staff take the ball and run with it.?ÿ I've come to believe that the best part of a promotion is watching?ÿthe staff you've trained fill your old shoes.?ÿ
A guy that was my top crew chief a couple of years ago at another firm is now licensed and a project manager; hearing him complain about the other groups in?ÿthe company padding their time on projects and ruining his budgets brings a tear of joy to my eye. ?ÿ?ÿ
... brings a tear of joy to my eye. ?ÿ?ÿ
sick bastard
sick bastard
Growing up in?ÿ suburbia we had one of those neighbors who obsessed about his yard. Perfectly manicured. Wouldn't let his?ÿkids on it. ?ÿMy brother and I tore the hell out of ours playing football. When our neighbor mentioned to my dad that we'd always have the worst looking yard in the neighborhood if he continued to let us play ball on it my dad replied "I'm not raising grass, I'm raising boys" ?ÿ
I'm not raising a new generation of surveyors; I'm?ÿraising a new generation of wealthy surveyors ??ÿ
This, is a fantastic thread.?ÿ I am sorry Ryan to hear your stress.?ÿ I hope that these other guys here who know how to use words better than I do somehow truly make you feel better.?ÿ How do you spell commiseration?
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That's why I turned to the family here. It's all good, but man, sometimes...
I signed up and completed my 40 hrs of Wetland Delineation Certification (which employer paid for) and I am really looking forward to this. While not surveying, it is surveying and mapping out land features, and its a change from doing the same thing. I will get to spend my day out with nature. One step closer to my idea niche market I am slowly trying to carve out for myself.?ÿ
The appeal of Surveying is the multitude of directions you can take it. If you dont enjoy it, do it differently. Sounds like your employer is helping with that. Life is too short to work for people that wont. There are tons of good jobs that pay well.?ÿ
I think it's?ÿall about trying to find some balance and knowing when to say no. I'm learning that?ÿtrying to carry the weight of the world on my shoulders and try and make everyone happy is a perfect recipe for misery. The simple truth is that life is short and you simply must find that balance between work, family and friends and the things that make you happy. The whole point of life is to be?ÿhappy and all the money in the world won't cut it if you?ÿhave to sacrifice your health and time with the?ÿpeople that you love.?ÿMy brother is a very successful attorney, millionaire many times over, real estate mogul, works 6-7 days a week and is the most miserable person I know.?ÿ?ÿWhen you're laying on your death bed staring the reaper in the face, about?ÿthe last thing in the world?ÿlikely to?ÿcross your mind is, "Ghee-wiz, I sure wish I'd spent more time at work."
Not bloody likely.
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That's why I turned to the family here. It's all good, but man, sometimes...
I signed up and completed my 40 hrs of Wetland Delineation Certification (which employer paid for) and I am really looking forward to this. While not surveying, it is surveying and mapping out land features, and its a change from doing the same thing. I will get to spend my day out with nature. One step closer to my idea niche market I am slowly trying to carve out for myself.?ÿ
So here's my question. ?ÿAre you going to be delegating or having your managers reassign some of your current duties? ?ÿ Because, at first glance, I don't see adding new service offerings, requiring both field, office, and marketing responsibilities is going to alleviate the problems you laid out in the OP. Unless your goal is building up a skill set for a new personal venture.?ÿ
One thing additionally; what was the age of the other students in your delineation class? ?ÿI took one in my mid thirties and everyone was at least ten years younger than me. ?ÿPoint being, you can perform delineations, but unless you can perform them cost effectively there isn't much of a point on the business side. ?ÿAround here delineations are performed by entry level environmental scientists; biology or environmental majors 1-5 years out of college. ?ÿAn experienced PLS bills anywhere from $150 - $250 per hour depending on the type of work and size of company in my market; the guys doing wetlands field work and permitting (and if you get into wetlands work on a large scale you're looking at 4-5 hours of meetings, reports, proposals, and submitting permits for clients for every hour in the field) are billing around $75/hour. ?ÿ
"Right now I'm figuring out how to involve a 4 year old boy in helping me with projects at home."
I'm trying to teach my 6 year old Grandson how cast a lightweight spinning reel (for spec fishin') WITHOUT hooking me first. I agree with Family first, followed by finances, country, and beach.
That's why I turned to the family here. It's all good, but man, sometimes...
I signed up and completed my 40 hrs of Wetland Delineation Certification (which employer paid for) and I am really looking forward to this. While not surveying, it is surveying and mapping out land features, and its a change from doing the same thing. I will get to spend my day out with nature. One step closer to my idea niche market I am slowly trying to carve out for myself.?ÿ
So here's my question. ?ÿAre you going to be delegating or having your managers reassign some of your current duties? ?ÿ Because, at first glance, I don't see adding new service offerings, requiring both field, office, and marketing responsibilities is going to alleviate the problems you laid out in the OP. Unless your goal is building up a skill set for a new personal venture.?ÿ
One thing additionally; what was the age of the other students in your delineation class? ?ÿI took one in my mid thirties and everyone was at least ten years younger than me. ?ÿPoint being, you can perform delineations, but unless you can perform them cost effectively there isn't much of a point on the business side. ?ÿAround here delineations are performed by entry level environmental scientists; biology or environmental majors 1-5 years out of college. ?ÿAn experienced PLS bills anywhere from $150 - $250 per hour depending on the type of work and size of company in my market; the guys doing wetlands field work and permitting (and if you get into wetlands work on a large scale you're looking at 4-5 hours of meetings, reports, proposals, and submitting permits for clients for every hour in the field) are billing around $75/hour. ?ÿ
The reason is a little of all the above. First of all I have always been interested in doing it, so why not. Second, at my current firm we sub out nearly all of the Environmental work. We do have an existing Environmental Department but it is small. My thoughts and discussion with this department head was that is we can offer the Delineation and perform the initial topographic surveys then why not do it? It just offers more appeal for the DOTs and Quasi Public entities.
Now your other questions...The folks in the class ranged from 22-55'ish, all with Master's Degrees. From what I can see delineation around here bills out at about 100-115 per hour. I am licensed in 4 States with 17 years experience and I am not even on the low end of your pay scale at a 100-150 person firm.?ÿI really enjoy hydrographic, stream bank stabilization and mitigation projects, so I was thinking delineation should be a natural service to add, if maybe one day I go solo, I could focus on this particular field.?ÿ
Just to be clear, James was referring to billing rates not pay.?ÿ I have to believe given some of the fancy toy's you've posted about having at your disposal that you're billing somewhere in that range, especially if your firm is working the public side on any kind of regular basis.?ÿ
