Trimble s5 joystick with tsc7

If F1 and F2 point to different spots, the TS needs to be collimated. When's the last time the instrument was collimated, and was the laser adjusted at the same time? If it's going out of whack regularly, the dealer's service team needs a swift kick in the rear.

See sheet 50 of the manual (located here) for laser adjustment.

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You have more patience than me, I won't even try to use the joystick and just watch the laser on a surface, and that goes for any instrument. If I don't have a camera in the scope, I'm just going to do all my reflectorless observations at the end of the setup looking through the scope. Way faster...sometime I'll even do it when I do have an instrument with a camera. Except for the SX of course, but with those triple cameras and insanely fast optical zoom I don't ever feel the need to look through a scope.

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The joystick is more for getting close enough to search and lock on, or to see the rod on the video screen and tap on it to grab a lock, not for pinpoint measurement.

I really don't understand why ANY of the newer robots come without a scope camera and video feed. For documentation alone it's well worth it; dynamic measurements, panoramas, station views and photogrammetric measurements are just icing on the cake.

@rover83?ÿ

It's still basically a new instrument. It's been this way since new, but I've collimated it twice and after the second time it stopped going out prematurely...

It points in the same spot face 1 and 2, it's just that the reflectorless doesn't shoot where the scope or laser pointer are pointing.?ÿ

The machine doesn't have a lot of hours yet because I kept going back to the Leica for the first 6 months at least. I have no issues with reflectorless on the Leica robot or the sx12.?ÿ

The reason I have to keep waking back and forth is because I need to use an object to create a 90 degree corner for the reflectorless shots. This is important on some shots no matter what the total station, but this one misses corners I would always get no problem with the Leica.?ÿ

So I was trying to use the joystick to save an extra trip back and forth through a ditch over and over again. The joystick will move 0.10 one of tap and 0.3 on the next one, sometimes it just keeps going for a couple meters. Same issue when I'm trying to get it close enough for the terrible search to find me.?ÿ

Sounds annoying as hell...the random movements during joystick operation sounds more like a communications lag. I wonder if you'd see any improvement as you move closer to the instrument. Those radio modules are never as robust as the datasheets claim.

Have you tried using the arrow keys on the physical keypad rather than tapping the touchscreen? Dunno if it will make much difference, but it might be more of a direct input than a touchscreen tap and susceptible to less lag. I think that is an option when in the joystick screen. I can work with the S series joystick, but it's nowhere near as good as the video feed. I tend to use the "turn 90 degrees" and "turn 180 degrees" functions first and avoid the individual keys for anything more than fine-tuning.

The SX series operates a bit different due to the cameras, but in the S series, the laser is coaxial with the line of sight/crosshairs, so there should be no (or very minimal) difference between the the crosshairs/angles & distance and the laser spot. It's not as narrow as a Leica TS but it should still be centered on the aiming point.

@rover83?ÿ

I use both the buttons and touchscreen for the joystick because you have to. If you change the speed, then the physical buttons only adjust that and no longer turn the instrument, so you must use the touchscreen and then the physical buttons.?ÿ

I had no issues using a touchscreen only Panasonic fz-m1 tablet before but when you're using the joystick, it's hard to press the right buttons while watching the robot and the guidelights to get it close enough to lock on, so the physical buttons are easy to control it with when you're turning it.?ÿ

I never had to think about this with the Leica or sokkias before it, as they had a search, which would turn and lock onto the robot. The s5 is more like a remote control total station than a robotic one IMO.?ÿ

For reflectorless the laser beam and scope do match exactly. It's just that where it's shooting reflectorless shots is often not the same as where you think it is.?ÿ

@rover83?ÿ

Forgot to reply about the distance from the robot. I'm usually not too far away but it doesn't seem to be any better when I'm standing only like 20 feet away from it.?ÿ

It doesn't seem noticeably worse when I'm a couple hundred feet or more away. And I could deal with it if it was only lagging a bit when I was a long ways away.?ÿ

The old Leica and Panasonic setup had pretty bad Bluetooth lag if you were like 600 feet away and almost out of Bluetooth range, but usually when I had to go that far I'd just throw up the extra tripod and backsight prism for the extra accuracy anyway so it wasn't often an issue with the Bluetooth range being worse than radio.?ÿ

The laser can also be aligned it use to be a little plastic rubbery cap and inside you have an adjustment screw. After you go through all the adjustments of instrument there should be a little laser reflection card target place that at the correct distance per manual and line it up. The laser is for pointing and i have found it useless myself. The green dot from leica or sx series is way better.?ÿ

now your joystick issue. I use the hard button one when i need to. We had a crew chief just go on vacation and i have been running a s5 with TSC7 all week running literally 10 hours straight. When i have issues I have noticed it is when the multitrack battery is getting low or the sun is right level with the scope and my direction. The other is some how with eyeglasses and safety goggles and eye balls sweating I had 3 different dxf files linked and two other job files linked along with some control file and stake out files. I noticed it started hanging up and acting weird. So i said enough went to the truck wiped my face went to job properties and said how did i click that many linked files now layer manager . ?ÿI never did like the touch screen joystick thingy. I am not the biggest fan always of touch screens. My fingers are to fat and eyes no good up close. But it is what it is . I still think you have some major issue with all the trouble. I know you have changed data collectors from TSC5 to TSC7 and still having issues. Maybe they need to re-flash the firmware in S5 . ?ÿI do get a no radio way to often and replaced the tsc7 antenna and still having it. I figured its the s5 antenna so boss man brought me one but they sold him the wrong one and now have to order the correct one. They sent the one for a tablet lol. Connector is different. Good luck man. I hope you get this all figured out. Hate to see you struggling. ?ÿHave you tried the new access software yet. I got a rental and its a year old so not had a chance to get a try at the new release. ?ÿ

I do want to pick your brain though. I have a new chief we just hired. He is going through all the hr mumbo jumbo. But he has always ran Leica never Trimble. How do I make his life easier. Adjusting to this mess. He will have different csv files for different task and same for dxf files etc. so unless he does like i did yesterday and links everything he should have smaller manageable files for each task and job.?ÿ

@olemanriver?ÿ

The laser does seem to be almost perfectly aligned with what I see through the scope. It's just that it always misses the corner, even if the entire beam is on it.?ÿ

I will try the thing with the card hopefully this weekend and redo the collimation again, even though it's still holding really tight angles between faces.?ÿ

I did try installing the newest firmware just last weekend, so it has been reflashed.?ÿ

The newest access has been installed. That solved the issue of it switching to passive mode after a check backsight shot. Other than that performance seems mostly the same. I've had no issues with radio connection since the one time it completely died and I had to remove and reinstall the radio module in the second slot. It almost always connects first try, though not very quickly.?ÿ

As far as switching to Trimble from Leica, I can't help on the software side because I never used actual Leica software (microsurvey fieldgenius). Other than that the biggest adjustment is if you're running it solo you have to get used to not having a proper search function and having to always use the joystick to regain lock (unless running integrated mode with the GNSS mounted on the prism). I've been doing that a lot lately, but the weight really sucks with the tsc7 and a bipod on the pole. Especially when you're carrying everything by yourself. That was a big adjustment from the light weight Panasonic 7" tablet in a light weight plastic pole mount and a grz4 360 prism. That was such a nice easy to carry setup.?ÿ

We've found importing the CSV works better for us and only linking the DXF. Today access did get really laggy toward the end of the day but it had been running for hours in the same job. Just needed a reboot I guess. It's also a large subdivision and DXF. Lots of points.?ÿ

But the size of the job doesn't seem to affect how the robot works. I can have a small local job and it still doesn't respond consistently with the joystick.?ÿ

@350rocketmike Gotcha. ?ÿI will keep that in mind as I have to teach him everything on Trimble. So I am sure that will be a frustrating change. My boss met me on a job to help out for a few hours and he kept getting ahead of his self a bit and he had a rental. I had to say slow down take a deep breath this is not 1990ƒ??s. I had to get his survey styles all set up. He said i know how to survey. It was good for him to see what actually is being done as he has been in the business side for so long he didnƒ??t realize all the information that was at hand just on a back-sight. He is always saying to everyone take a bs check after you set up I want a bs check. I said watch this as I showed him once you measure your bs on station set up you get everything hz angle va angle slope distance hz distance delta vertical delta etc. i said ow tell me we need a bs ck on set up. You only need it as you are working and want to make sure the kid down the road didnƒ??t hit it with his scooter or settling etc. i did show him the routine bs check and ck topo etc.?ÿ

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then for giggles he was done with a task and he had shut down and exited his job came over and said i am done. He staked 8 points for me while i was doing rtk work. I said hay go shoot thes four shots. He said i have to go back and take bs etc. i said nope. So I painted a dot on the ground took a shot had him create a completely new job and use last set up to start. He was freaking out until i had him key the point in i just shot and stake it out as a check. He thought i was doing some voodoo majic. He still went to another control point to ck. And came back and said ok this is awesome. And i no longer have to tell crew chiefs to stake out the bs after set up. One less thing to do.?ÿ

even if you have gun in wrong face on bs so instead of a 90 degree va angle its 270 its still right. Not like the old days where everything came in 180 off lol. Crazy how things have changed?ÿ

@olemanriver?ÿ

I always backsight F1 and f2 cause it flips so fast it doesn't add a huge amount of time, plus it's an instant check on the collimation of the gun when you see your Hz and vertical angle difference. I do sometimes wait for it to flip back to face 1 and see that the angle is indeed 0 0' 00" within a few seconds before I walk away.?ÿ

I often shoot checks as the original number so I'm not adding more points to already huge jobs.?ÿ

I also tweaked my settings to display all the stuff I want to see and not the stuff I don't.