I've just begun reading about route survey techniques (DF&K chap 27; G&W chap 24)...curves, spirals, transitions, superelevation, etc.). It got me to thinking how much a difference a well designed highway can make. My commute to work takes me on a 10 mile stretch of highway that winds beside a significant river here in Vermont, that was largely wiped out by Tropical Storm Irene.
They re-built it exactly where it was; no change in route; a few elevation corrections, but they re-graded the superelevations along the entire 10 miles. It's just a total work of art.
Anyone who has driven, say the Taconic State Parkway, that stretches from north of NYC to near Albany, or, even better: the Pacific Coast Highway, which was completed in the 30's I think, has to appreciate the stunning results of what those surveyors and CE's did in their day.
It raises two questions:
1. Do surveyors ever get this opportunity any more? I mean, all the roads (at least in the US) are built already. Where could you possibly sculpt from scratch a classically perfect highway? Has anyone here ever done so?
2. In digging into the trig of standard curves, spirals, reverse curves etc. I'd love to know whether it's time usefully spent doing this much math. Do standard surveying packages (Carlson, ACAD C3D, etc.) have all this stuff built in? Can you layout curves and have the software implement the appropriate transitions and set superelevations, given the designated speed of the route?
I'm not opposed to doing it, but I'm thinking I'd be better off just learning for now what makes for perfection in a route, rather than slaving away at the mathematical techniques for creating one.
In my opinion it is always nice to know, what is happening,when you 'push the buttons" and what is suppose to be the output and why.
:-O :-S 😀
[sarcasm]It is also helped to have a professional moto grader operator with years of experience to complete the team.[/sarcasm]
> 1. Do surveyors ever get this opportunity any more? I mean, all the roads (at least in the US) are built already. Where could you possibly sculpt from scratch a classically perfect highway? Has anyone here ever done so?
Point well made rfc. It is truly amazing at some of the roads and other various means of rail, sea, etc that have been accomplished in some of the most difficult terrain & conditions imaginable.
In the past 10 yrs I got to be eye witness to the construction of the Hoover Dam bypass bridge. Given the terrain, funding, and impact to both the river and the fragile mountains - it was a pretty tough challenge in such a short period of time, especially the approach on the NV side. I looked for a cool video they used to have out, but now there are too many to post. Google away.
I think most of us have that same appreciation of some of those significant construction achievements man has accomplished to make us safe as we move about. Sometimes not so safe, but what the heck.
1) Sure, there are subdivision roads and redesign of less than classic original designs, and redesign due to increased use. There are usually new and elegant ways to approach old problems. Surveyors are involved to one extent or another, depending on the State in the U.S., not sure about other countries.
2) The programs require more than merely speed. They allow you to build models from all of the pertinent design criteria for a particular highway. But there is usually more than one way to put it all together. A classic result is always dependent on a good team of engineers and surveyors with differing special knowledge, even in the age of computers. Pretty much anyone with knowledge of a particular program could put together a highway plan that merely met criteria. But it really requires a knowledge of the math behind the parts in order to design and build a really nice highway within all the economic, legal, environmental, physics, and psychological (user perceptions) factors present in any given situation.
I do wonder on occasion if there will come a time when we stop teaching and learning math (for the bulk of people) and just learn computer software procedures. If speech recognition software is perfected, why learn to type (or read or write for that matter)? With advances in science and technology much old traditional knowledge has been retained longest by the poorest and then finally lost. It would be ironic if only the poorest, who can't afford computers, are the last to know math, reading and writing.
But I digress; for now, knowing the math before trying to design with the computer software is not only desirable, but necessary in my view.
When doing rehab work on existing roads, it is possible to make super corrections with careful grinding and paving.
