Ring Ring

[USER=3579]@spledeus[/USER]

At least have the caller make a request in an email to have a record of your conversation.
From a surveyor that has had to jump thru a lot of hoops to get my hands on information, I've found it best to have access to the people I help.
Some day you will need a help too.

We have had many individuals argue against takings. We just completed updating a 1997 road taking that apparently was not advertised property by the Town. Nobody cared until they decided to put sidewalks in the layout.

Our past 2 town counsels have not believed it was necessary to take easements over private roads for the installation and maintenance of sewers. They relied on a law that enables one with a right of way to have the right to install utilities. The current Town Counsel has pushed for the easements and provided a mechanism for the selectmen to take those easements without a Town Meeting Vote.

Now we and the Town's Director of Natural Resources, who is in charge of the sewer project, are being inundated with calls from high priced legal firms representing owners of high priced properties that are having Sewer, Water and Utility easements taken with proper notification.

The land court example above is very true. A couple years ago, an $18M sale fell through because the Land Court took issue with the conveyance of a road without the documentation that it was a separate lot.

I have a few e-mails back and forth with the Librarian. I made sure to send one describing which property she was reviewing, since she did not seem to be aware of the title basics.

We are encountering many problems with utilities and providers that install their equipment in and along public rural roadways.
There is no record kept where the installation is made and each new installation conflicts with what is already there causing outages and rework.
Then road maintenance comes along and destroys much of what was improperly installed.
They all are working under a law that is on the books that they can use that corridor for their installation.
The problem is that the governing officials do not make them comply to any desired standard.
I have land along a private road that the water company came in and installed a service line that dug up and destroyed mine and everyone's monuments that were at least 1.5ft deep or more in the center of the roadway and never sought to obtain easement.
It also destroyed the telephone system in place.
The same thing happened at my office when their work left me without phone service for a week.
It is a never ending processional of idiots that are planning for improvements without any sense of what it takes to accomplish what they want.
They attempt to wing it inhouse without reaching out to the professionals that can get it done property.

Andy,

Someday, and that day may never come, I will call upon you to do a service for me.

Right?

Jack

Possibly you should bill them?

"Her: I am having trouble with the antiquated Browntech Registry Website.
Me: It may be a little older, but it is the only registry in the Commonwealth that has scanned documents back to the beginning.
Her: Well, when it works, it makes me pay."

Why do research for free that they do not want to pay for elsewhere?

Paul in PA

Paul in PA, post: 454724, member: 236 wrote: Possibly you should bill them?

"Her: I am having trouble with the antiquated Browntech Registry Website.
Me: It may be a little older, but it is the only registry in the Commonwealth that has scanned documents back to the beginning.
Her: Well, when it works, it makes me pay."

Why do research for free that they do not want to pay for elsewhere?

Paul in PA

That is a tough one. Her improper identification led me to help. I will share the encounter with the director in charge of the sewer to let him know I dealt with one without simply sending them his way. I have someone uploading all the plans to a website for viewing and will provide the link to the director.
Since 2009 we have surveyed more than 30 miles for this project and we have more on the way. I would rather keep it moving with a few minor helpful freebies than irritate someone who has concerns over the project.

spledeus, post: 454695, member: 3579 wrote: "I am from the Boston Library....."

Not a wonder that you were mislead by that. I'm sure it was calculated to do just that.

spledeus, post: 454695, member: 3579 wrote: "As a librarian I am bound by a code of ethics and I am not allowed to ask such questions...."

Huh? The librarian code of ethics?

Mark Mayer, post: 454808, member: 424 wrote: Huh? The librarian code of ethics?

[SARCASM]First rule of Librarian Code of Ethics, never mention the library.[/SARCASM]

http://www.ala.org/Template.cfm?Section=coehistory&Template=/ContentManagement/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentID=8875

James Fleming, post: 454810, member: 136 wrote: http://www.ala.org/Template.cfm?Section=coehistory&Template=/ContentManagement/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentID=8875

If I ever get a call from a Librarian, I am going to have to quiz her on the Dewey Decimal System, just to make sure she is who she says she is.

I asked the librarian where the Self Help section was and she said, "Wouldn't that defeat the purpose if I told you?"

R.J. Schneider, post: 454809, member: 409 wrote: [SARCASM]First rule of Librarian Code of Ethics, never mention the library.[/SARCASM]

er...I think it was to never mention it aloud.

While I was in the library last time some guy came in and shouted to the lady behind the desk, "I'D LIKE A HAMBURGER AND FRIES!"
She said, "Sir, this is a library."
He looked around, leaned over the desk and whispered. "I'd like a hamburger and fries."

spledeus, post: 454695, member: 3579 wrote: Her: I am from the Boston Library and I was asked to research a taking that your firm helped prepare.
Me: Sure, I'd be happy to help. How does a librarian get roped into title research.
Her: Well they ask and I provide.
Me: OK, so where is the property?
Her: I have this reference "Plan dated, XX-XX-2015, Entitled Sewer, Water and Utility Easement Plan"
Me: OK, so what street is your client on?
Her: Can't you just find it based on that reference?
Me: Well, we prepared several plans with that same title and without the street, I can only guess which plan it is.
Her: I am having trouble with the antiquated Browntech Registry Website.
Me: It may be a little older, but it is the only registry in the Commonwealth that has scanned documents back to the beginning.
Her: Well, when it works, it makes me pay.
Me: And that is how we have every record back to the fire scanned in and available.
Her: Well I keep searching in this section for the plan.
Me: You are searching in the deed research, not the plan research section below.
Her: Oh, there's a difference?
Me: How much title research do you get asked to do?
Her: Well, when someone asks for something, I find it.
Me: OK, well, what is the owner's name?
Her: Kipper Realty Trust (Name changed to something else just like every name used here)
Me: Do you have a title reference?
Her: Yes it is registered in the land court as Deed Book XXX, Page XX.
Me: Oh, that's recorded at the registry, not registered at the land court. I found the document and it references plan book XXX, pages 1-16.
Her: OK, so can you find the plan from that.
Me: OK, here is their reference in the abstract. Still not sure which street, let me look in the GIS.
...
Me: Their property is along Old Bird Farm Road. There are no takings there. Hang on. OK, Their property backs up to Shallup Place, perhaps that is where the taking is.
Me: It looked like they purchased the property last year from Robertman, is this the one?
Her: As I librarian I am bound by a code of ethics and I am not allowed to ask such questions.
Me: OK, it's public record and I have the plan, Plan Book XXX, Page 15. It appears on our plan as Robertman who held the title in 2015 when we prepared the plan. It also shows NO FEE INTEREST, so I am unsure why they recorded a taking against this property.
Her: What do you mean?
Me: Are you a lawyer?
Her: No, I am a librarian.
Me: Well, lawyers often mess up the subtleties of conveyancing. With this taking project, we have found several cases of roads being erroneously conveyed multiple times or not at all or illegally. One land courted property included a conveyance of the fee of a road but the underlying plan did not call out the road as a separate lot and technically the conveyance could be made illegitimate by the court. Because of these flaws or potential flaws, it is my understanding that Town Counsel is setting up the takings against anybody who may have a claim of title or a potential title to ensure there are no issues moving forward.
Her: Can you send me the plans?
Me: Sure, email?
Her: [email protected]
Me: Here you go.

So I looked up the URL and then her linked in. She allowed confusion as I had assumed she worked at Boston Public Library. She works in the Law Library at a Big Legal Firm that specializes in many areas including Real Estate. She should have disclosed that she was working for an attorney, but what do I know?

So my real question: If they specialize in Real Estate, why do they need to contact a surveyor to provide them with research from a Registry?

I am involved in one survey that is a particular nightmare. The survey itself was not at all difficult to resolve but it is on the Hudson River across from NYC and has several riparian grants from the State on NJ. All the documentation was included in the title report and clearly illustrated and hatched on the face of the survey with the recording information clearly noted for each grant.
My client is having a difficult time with financing. Closing was to have happened last April but fell through because of a difficult lender. We are now on the 4th round of lender review and with each new prospective lender comes due diligence and legal review with a barrage of phone calls and demands from law clerks and attorneys who have no clue of what they are asking for or even looking at. I've probably been arguing with Attorneys for 80 hours since April and all are from out od state and have no clue what riparian grants are or any sort of water boundary issues.
The latest call I got was yesterday afternoon at about 3:30 from an Attorney in Boston telling me to revise my plan to illustrate all riparian lands not granted and get him a revised pdf copy of the plan by 5 PM. I broke out in laughter and explained to him that the areas not granted lie along the bulkhead and the areas granted are clearly shown. He had no clue what a high water line was nor what a bulkhead or peerhead line was and closing is again scheduled for Tuesday morning. Another 45 minutes of my life gone in that argument, if it's not shown as a grant than no grant exists. Fortunately I get paid by the hour for arguing with the clowns and educating on things they should already know.

[QUOTE=" Fortunately I get paid by the hour for arguing with the clowns and educating on things they should already know.

Mean High Water, huh? It sounds like Angry Intoxicated H2O. You're not advertising narcotics on your surveys, are you? :mad::p:cold_sweat:

Chris Bouffard, post: 455068, member: 12313 wrote: I am involved in one survey that is a particular nightmare. The survey itself was not at all difficult to resolve but it is on the Hudson River across from NYC and has several riparian grants from the State on NJ. All the documentation was included in the title report and clearly illustrated and hatched on the face of the survey with the recording information clearly noted for each grant.
My client is having a difficult time with financing. Closing was to have happened last April but fell through because of a difficult lender. We are now on the 4th round of lender review and with each new prospective lender comes due diligence and legal review with a barrage of phone calls and demands from law clerks and attorneys who have no clue of what they are asking for or even looking at. I've probably been arguing with Attorneys for 80 hours since April and all are from out od state and have no clue what riparian grants are or any sort of water boundary issues.
The latest call I got was yesterday afternoon at about 3:30 from an Attorney in Boston telling me to revise my plan to illustrate all riparian lands not granted and get him a revised pdf copy of the plan by 5 PM. I broke out in laughter and explained to him that the areas not granted lie along the bulkhead and the areas granted are clearly shown. He had no clue what a high water line was nor what a bulkhead or peerhead line was and closing is again scheduled for Tuesday morning. Another 45 minutes of my life gone in that argument, if it's not shown as a grant than no grant exists. Fortunately I get paid by the hour for arguing with the clowns and educating on things they should already know.

Yikes! Good for you.