Surveyors have a hard enough time agreeing on the location of a monument, I can't help buy wonder how many variations and differences there are/have been with the location of a house shown of a MLI, ILC, etc
Basically an MLI certifies that a house is on the lot. If there is a setback issue and a question on monumentation the MLI should state so and recommend a full boundary survey. Remember, a MLI is only an inspection. For the record, I do about three MLIs per year.
That's a good point 6th... I never thought about that (I've always assumed that ILC's done over periods of time would more or less match each other). I'd be interested to hear some of the stories on these.
Chuck
In Oklahoma there is a huge variance on the quality of the Mortgage Inspection Certificates in Okie land. (MIC) But I call them Mickey's because sometimes you feel like they are a Walt Disney fantasy product.
Many of the ones I've seen across the state show no improvements other than the house. No fences, pools or anything else. I suppose they fill the need by the closing agent to prove that there is indeed a house to the mortgage company and that it is not a vacant lot. I've heard of some doing these for $50 to $125 dollars. I will preface that with the companies that are heavy into these have usually done the same houses over and over and have little to do but change the date/name on the cert and hopefully, at least do a drive by. BTW- Many call these driveby surveys.
We only have one guy in Lawton that does these and I give him his due props. He charges for a full survey, does a full survey and shows everything even though he uses the MIC form and disclaimer. We have no jackwagon survey companies in Lawton to compete with him so he does a full professional job AND gets a full professional fee for his work. Kudo's to Denney.
So for Oklahoma there is a lot of variance in the quality of the products.
>
> I suppose they fill the need by the closing agent to prove that there is indeed a house to the mortgage company and that it is not a vacant lot.
Fill a need - In Deed
I know of a couple of guys that makes a killing doing these things
Not very popular in the surveying community,
but if you can get past the issues with your peers,
you could be putting a few green backs in your pocket.
Make BIG Money Doing Easy Drive-By Surveys
"Coming Soon ... A video of actual Drive By Surveys taking place. Watch me in action and see how easy it really is."
> Make BIG Money Doing Easy Drive-By Surveys
>
> "Coming Soon ... A video of actual Drive By Surveys taking place. Watch me in action and see how easy it really is."
Dan,
If I recall, years ago this web site appeared and someone contacted them,
these 'mortgage surveys' are not surveys, but an inventory report of sorts.
No drawings, no property lines. Consists of filling out a report and
providing photos and condition of the house, detailing the condition
of the banks' assets.
Deral,
I do the same thing here that your friend does.
We call them lot finals here in West Tennessee, at least in my neck of the woods. We always did a full boundary when I was employed for others, and I definitely do the same thing now.
We can't get the same fees that some others get in other areas of the country, but I do okay, and it's great exposure for the company (marketing wise).
Jimmy
> ... these 'mortgage surveys' are not surveys, but an inventory report of sorts.
> No drawings, no property lines. Consists of filling out a report and
> providing photos and condition of the house, detailing the condition
> of the banks' assets.
Well then, I should be able to sign up and do a few without jeopardizing my survey license. BIG Money here I come.
These "surveys" are the very first thing that Mark Deal and i talked about on the phone over 10 years ago. And, we were in complete agreement.
MLIs are a plight and a plague on our profession. They are patently fraudulent on their face, and are a total misrepresentation of our profession to the public. They are counterintuitive to the publics' best interest.
In short, they are bad.
Every individual holding one of those damn things, and unfortunately many LSs are among them, considers themselves to be holding a "survey". BALDERDASH!
They should be outlawed!
But like all the other falsehoods driven in our financial communities purely by greed and falsehood, these devices pencil whip the truth for profit. And so, they continue.
But not by me!
david in Winamac
> Surveyors have a hard enough time agreeing on the location of a monument, I can't help buy wonder how many variations and differences there are/have been with the location of a house shown of a MLI, ILC, etc
Ironically, I would think there would be few variations - in my experience, the parcels / lots are mostly located by tieing into whatever section corners / block corners / plat corners; sometimes property corners aren't even utilized (if looked for).
I knew a lone-dog surveyor who was billing over 6 figures doing primarily just mortgage inspections! $150 a pop, $200 for rushes. He'd do a handful during the day, draft 'em at nite, and on thru the week. I doubt he's faring any too well in this present economy though.
[edit] I agree, they are junk...but junk or not, better that surveyors haven't lost this income source yet to the GIS'ers or God forbid - realtors. Maybe if ASTM (or similar org) comes out with a standard specification for these, they could be slightly more acceptable(?)
>"I have done 200 of these in as little as 2 weeks, pocketing $4,200.) And, that was working a few hours a day."
Hmmm, that's $21 each after buying gasoline.
Hope your car insurance company doesn't find out you are using the car in a business.
And if a "few hours" is less than a full day, lets say 6 hrs * 10 days * 60 min/hr divided by 200 then he spends 18 minutes getting to each site, examining it, and doing the paperwork.
You are absolutely correct Butch on all counts. MLIs are junk to surveyors, but to lenders they are a needed service. In my experience it is those surveyors who can't get the banks to request their services for MLIs who are the ones who bash them the most.
"Patently fraudulent"???!!!!
I have been doing MLI's for years and nearly every surveyor I know of in this area has too. They were explicitly listed as an acceptable product in our board's standards for many years. So I frankly resent the allegation that my peers and I are providing a "patently fraudulent" service. And I am bewildered by the notion that "Every individual holding one of those damn things, and unfortunately many LSs are among them, considers themselves to be holding a 'survey'." Mine have a prominently placed note in capital letters saying "THIS IS NOT A BOUNDARY SURVEY" and extensive annotations about the product's limitations. They are provided only to title insurers and their agents who know damn well what they are getting. It has been years since anyone told me they thought an MLI was a survey and it's only happened maybe 3 times in 20+ years.
Merlin is right about some of the MLI's detractors. In the past I have heard two righteously indignant surveyors at State meetings loudly assert that anyone who does MLI's is "prostituting himself" and other nonsense. I later ran into these protesters separately and found that each, upon receiving calls from attorneys offering to send him several MLI's a week, had had an abrupt and mystical conversion and had started doing them.
I would add that, regarding the serious problems I've discovered over the years doing MLI's (major encroachments, setback and zoning violations, etc), in probably 2/3 of the cases there had previously been a survey. The problem wasn't the lack of a survey, it was the failure of the homeowner or contractor or outconveyancer to properly use the survey.
MLI's provide title insurers the amount of data they require to issue a title policy which in turn makes closings happen. That makes them useful. And at least in central Maine, there is neither the money nor the time nor the manpower to make a survey requirement for every closing realistic. Far from it.
If you don't want to do MLI's, fine, but do not impugn the integrity of your professional peers who do them, especially when their licensing board, their local peers, and decades of established practice say they are rendering a useful and patently legitimate service.
"Patently fraudulent"???!!!!
well...we've all had our say, some of us disagree, that's the end of it.
i hold no malice for you and wish you well.
dla