Gene Kooper, post: 445450, member: 9850 wrote: Well, Kent when you have no field experience in using a "black box" others will assume that you have some professional background in the field when you spout about the utility of a remote sensing technique such as GPR.
So, should we mark you down as a GPR skeptic? I've read enough about GPR to have concluded that finding a stone 8 x 8 or larger buried about 24 inches below pavement grade is not the most demanding application of the technology. It's a bit like asking whether an EDM that is rated at more than 3 miles can also measure a distance of 10 ft.
Dave Karoly, post: 445451, member: 94 wrote: I'm thinking after you and Ellis uncover the stones the movie will star Jackie Chan as you and Chris Tucker as Scot Ellis! A la Rush Hour (1998).
Well, as Jack Nicholson said in "The Five Easy Pieces", hold that thought.
Dave Karoly, post: 445451, member: 94 wrote: I'm thinking after you and Ellis uncover the stones the movie will star Jackie Chan as you and Chris Tucker as Scot Ellis! A la Rush Hour (1998).
Dave,
I am sure we can find someone from this movie to play you as cameo.
Kent McMillan, post: 445453, member: 3 wrote: Well, as Jack Nicholson said in "The Five Easy Pieces", hold that thought.
In real life it'll be simple, 15 minutes with your GPR 30 minutes of digging to the stone, pretty boring. But the movie will have a lot more drama, of course, king fu, bad guys shooting at your character, stuff like that.
But first you have to do what you said you could do.
Dave Karoly, post: 445457, member: 94 wrote: In real life it'll be simple, 15 minutes with your GPR 30 minutes of digging to the stone, pretty boring. But the movie will have a lot more drama, of course, king fu, bad guys shooting at your character, stuff like that.
But first you have to do what you said you could do.
Oh, I'm definitely going to rent a GPR unit as the need arises and I'll be sure to let you know what you''ve been missing out on. For the longer term, though, what would be a super-useful invention is something that costs not much more than a Schonstedt and that is optimized for imaging subsurface non-ferrous objects about the size and density of set stones (scale of 8 inches to maybe 12 inches).
Kent McMillan, post: 445452, member: 3 wrote: So, should we mark you down as a GPR skeptic? I've read enough about GPR to have concluded that finding a stone 8 x 8 or larger buried about 24 inches below pavement grade is not the most demanding application of the technology. It's a bit like asking whether an EDM that is rated at more than 3 miles can also measure a distance of 10 ft.
Kent, One of us has used GPR equipment and the other has Google knowledge that GPR MAY work. If that makes me a skeptic, what does it make you? You lambast others here for not using a tool that, at best you only think should work. Again, Dave and I have merely nudged you to prove that the technology does what the sales literature you found and read from Google searches actually works. In my defense, I've suggested that you develop your field techniques in Austin whereas Dave is suggesting a road trip. 😉
Like most investigative tools, GPR has its strengths and its limitations. I learned many years ago about the wisdom of ground truth. In lay terms for you, the utility of a remote sensing tool is only demonstrated after getting Vibram on the ground and measuring, collecting, observing whatever the tool is supposedly collecting remotely.
The other variable that you are conveniently sidestepping is the technical skill required to operate the equipment. If one, such as yourself is inclined to see the technology work, perhaps you could find a local vendor that uses GPR to locate underground utilities. They may be able to adapt their service to finding those precious stones buried in an old Texas road that you occasionally are required to find.
Best of luck.
Gene Kooper, post: 445459, member: 9850 wrote: One of us has used GPR equipment and the other has Google knowledge that GPR MAY work. If that makes me a skeptic, what does it make you?
Well if you have used modern GPR equipment, it would be an uncharacteristically (for you) valuable contribution to the discussion to mention the details of that use, including the year, manufacturer and model no.
Recent anniversary of Lady Diana's death. She was the spokesperson for the HALO Trust who are one of vanguards for landmine detection.
The recent advancement of portable GPR has been rapid oddly enough by landmine detection and demining.
They are equipped with multiple filters for soil conditions.
USA military also utilize such devices.
They will become more affordable for use. Some are affordable now. Technology moves faster than time and time moves fast enough for me.
Archaeologists, surveyors and related professions will use them in the near future.
http://www.jmu.edu/cisr/journal/18.2/r-and-d/daniels.shtml
https://www.halotrust.org/what-we-do/demining/manual-demining/
Shouldn't the children have been in bed by some of the replies here?
Sure, Kent. The work was published. I'm sure you will immediately dismiss the work as its purpose was not to locate stones set in the distant past underneath an old road bed and the author is a geologist. Since you are so fond of Google, please do a Google search for "The Application of Ground Penetrating Radar to Mineral Specimen Mining".
Alvin Tostick, post: 445464, member: 13000 wrote: Recent anniversary of Lady Diana's death. She was the spokesperson for the HALO Trust who are one of vanguards for landmine detection.
The recent advancement of portable GPR has been rapid oddly enough by landmine detection and demining.
They are equipped with multiple filters for soil conditions.
USA military also utilize such devices.They will become more affordable for use. Some are affordable now. Technology moves faster than time and time moves fast enough for me.
Archaeologists, surveyors and related professions will use them in the near future.http://www.jmu.edu/cisr/journal/18.2/r-and-d/daniels.shtml
https://www.halotrust.org/what-we-do/demining/manual-demining/
Edit: didn't Schoenstedt originate as a mine detector?
Shouldn't the children have been in bed by some of the replies here?
Gene Kooper, post: 445465, member: 9850 wrote: Sure, Kent. The work was published. I'm sure you will immediately dismiss the work as its purpose was not to locate stones set in the distant past underneath an old road bed and the author is a geologist. Since you are so fond of Google, please do a Google search for "The Application of Ground Penetrating Radar to Mineral Specimen Mining".
Can you, in a nutshell, describe what you believe to be the relevance of "Mineral Specimen Mining" to searching for set stones in roadbeds and, more importantly, when this investigation was made by the geologists you were evidently working for?
Alvin Tostick, post: 445466, member: 13000 wrote:
Recent anniversary of Lady Diana's death. She was the spokesperson for the HALO Trust who are one of vanguards for landmine detection.
The recent advancement of portable GPR has been rapid oddly enough by landmine detection and demining.
They are equipped with multiple filters for soil conditions.
USA military also utilize such devices.They will become more affordable for use. Some are affordable now. Technology moves faster than time and time moves fast enough for me.
Archaeologists, surveyors and related professions will use them in the near future.http://www.jmu.edu/cisr/journal/18.2/r-and-d/daniels.shtml
https://www.halotrust.org/what-we-do/demining/manual-demining/
Yes the development of GPR has been quite significant in recent years. That was part of why I was interested to know when exactly Eugene Kooper had been involved in the use of GPR for such purposes as were then thought to be relevant.
I believe it was Madeline Kahn who sang, "I'm so tired.........................."
Holy Cow, post: 445469, member: 50 wrote: I believe it was Madeline Kahn who sang, "I'm so tired.........................."
Okay, I make no judgments if you want to go with:
"Here I stand, the goddess of Desire
Set men on fire
I have this power
Morning noon and night it's drink and dancing
Some quick romancing
And then a shower"
Why do so many of these threads devolve into a pissing match between the same folks? I hope the original poster was able to glean some useful information from the earlier part of the discussion, and am not surprised that he or she has not returned.
This was Harmonyville, until the surveyor's showed up.
Insert the word "clients" where she uses the word "men" and the word "surveying" for "love". The song largely represents the survey profession over the decades. Her mournful singing of "I'm so tired" fits the feeling of surveyors who, no matter how much they know and have experienced, are always told they are wrong by somebody.
[MEDIA=youtube]Uai7M4RpoLU[/MEDIA]
How's that for a hijack? Now you all can be hearing "I'm so tired" scrolling through your thoughts all day long as you go about some more thrill-packed fun and excitement called surveying.
p.s. As for her comment on everything below the waist being shot, based on stories here old surveyors are pretty well shot from skull to foot.
Peter Lothian - MA ME, post: 445491, member: 4512 wrote: Why do so many of these threads devolve into a pissing match between the same folks? I hope the original poster was able to glean some useful information from the earlier part of the discussion, and am not surprised that he or she has not returned.
This was Harmonyville, until the surveyor's showed up.
I don't blame her at all, she basically got nothing here, at least nothing useful.
It would be interesting to hear how disputed boundaries are resolved in PA, this can't be the first one.
MightyMoe, post: 445497, member: 700 wrote: It would be interesting to hear how disputed boundaries are resolved in PA, this can't be the first one.
For example:
96. Lenihan v. Davis
Superior Court of Pennsylvania. April 13, 1943 152 Pa.Super. 47
Headnote: In suit in ejectment between owners of adjoining lots each claiming 8-inch wide strip between the lots, parol
evidence was properly admitted to establish location of old fence between the lots, though there was no call for a fence in
descriptions given in deeds, where according to plaintiffs' evidence fence had been there and was recognized as boundary line
by parties to the action and their predecessors in title for more than 21 years.
2 Cases that cite this legal issue
Document Summary: Appeal No. 38, February term, 1943, from judgment of Court of Common Pleas of
Lackawanna County at No. 513, January Term, 1942; Michael J. Eagen, Judge. Suit in ejectment by Bessie
Lenihan and others against Frank Davis and Bertha Davis. From a judgment in favor of the plaintiffs, the
defendants appeal. Judgment affirmed.
This case appears to involve a 1982 Survey; I can't tell from the face of the survey if monuments were set. So the facts are somewhat different.
Another case:
5. Collins v. Clough
Supreme Court of Pennsylvania. January 4, 1909 222 Pa. 472
Headnote: Where the line between adjoining tracts, claimed under original warrants, is disputed, and that line once
ascertained is a determining factor, it should be first ascertained, if possible, which tract was first located.
And this:
36. Long Run Timber Company v. Department of Conservation and Natural Resources
Commonwealth Court of Pennsylvania. August 30, 2016 145 A.3d 1217
Headnote: Monuments not mentioned in a deed may be utilized in a boundary dispute action if said monuments are afterward
erected by the parties with intent to conform to the deed; nevertheless, if the monuments are doubtful, a resort will be had to
the courses, distances, and quantity.
I have to do work now. I have all the Westlaw headnotes under Boundaries in two PDF files but they are copyrighted so probably not cool to upload the PDF files.
insightful/inciteful...yuk, yuk. that was a good one.