Destruction of Street Monuments

Some years ago I was involved in a large residential subdivision under construction that 90% of the front corners were destroyed by utility installation. A solution we attempted to use was to set the front corners at a ten foot offset so that they would have a much smaller chance of being destroyed. Unfortunately the BOR and the city would not allow due to existing law, which we aware of, so we went ahead and set both the corner and the offset. Problem solved. This all being said, I believe offsets should be required by law on the front if it is known that utility construction will likely remove the actual lot corner.

I work at the County of Maui and have recently implemented a Monument Certification program where a consultant is hired to survey in the location of existing street monuments before any road resurfacing/construction is done. The same consultant then checks the monuments after construction/resurfacing and if any have been disturbed the contractor is required to replace the disturbed monuments at their cost. It is amazing how many have been replaced since the program was started, which probably means a lot have been destroyed or disturbed in the past without the contractor notifying the County.

Nice job! :good:

Wish we had something like that around here. Every time I bring something like that up I get the "it will cost too much" and the "not enough in the budget" excuses.

Congratulations! Can we get you to come work in Northern Arizona? Our centerline monuments are disappearing at an alarming rate... We have no City surveyor and no one who cares!

Go after the licensees. Somewhere up the chain of project management is a supervision engineer. Just present the facts to the board. There are statutes for all the public against destruction of monuments, and the PE's are held to protect the public as well.

I know for a fact someone needs to be sanctioned in Sacramento. Their street and handicap curb installs have wiped out whole neighborhoods of mons and witnesses, hundreds per mile. Primary arterials wiped clean.

> Some years ago I was involved in a large residential subdivision under construction that 90% of the front corners were destroyed by utility installation. A solution we attempted to use was to set the front corners at a ten foot offset so that they would have a much smaller chance of being destroyed. Unfortunately the BOR and the city would not allow due to existing law, which we aware of, so we went ahead and set both the corner and the offset. Problem solved. This all being said, I believe offsets should be required by law on the front if it is known that utility construction will likely remove the actual lot corner.

Our SOP are monuments of some sort in the curb line, where there is one. These are much more permanent than rebar, and leave little doubt to what they are. We cover their placement in the plat.

Some municipalities have something against this, and insist on a front corner as well. (In which case we do not set the curb o/s' since there is rarely $$$ in the budget for two front monuments.)

Also, as long a record of survey is being recorded, I feel that offsets in concrete are a great value to any of our clients that order a survey. They are much more likely to be found 5 years from now than a rebar set flush with the ground.

Many of property corners have been destroyed due to side walk renovation in a nearby city. I sent a question to the board about locating corners before construction and replacing afterwards. My question to the board, does this constitute a boundary survey? The board wants more information before answering my question. What has been done in other KY cities. What about other areas of the country? BTW, the corners are not mine but most are shown on old plats, some pipes are not shown on plats or referenced in deeds. We are also losing city street monuments due to construction.

:good:

Check into our Calif statutes.
We made it the City Engineers responsibility but there is always the enforcement issue.
We had to amend the original statue as vertical control points were not specifically included so now they are too.
We use what is called a "Corner Record". A preconstruction CR is made showing ties that will stay during const, then a final CR showing the character of the monument and if a centerline control mon the curb ties.
One city had a survey co tie out all their CL mons prior to a arterial street rehab. The existing curbs were not to be disturbed. Somewhere during the const the decision was made to replace the curbs too. They did tell the survey co. The survey company got a call that the street work was done and they could reset the mons. Imagine their surprise to see all new curbs and the ties gone. Took a major survey project to reset the mons from mons on adjacent streets.

Epidemic in Oregon too.....

It's sad to see... the PLSO really should address this with the
communities here in Oregon. I'd wager a good deal of city councils and
county commissioners have no idea the public is losing such a valuable
resource for it's property owners.

I know so many surveyors that complain, and it's exactly the same
sort of nonsense each time. Some agency management thinks that
another catch basin is a feather in the cap for their department while
keeping their roadway centerline monuments is nothing more than a bother
for their projects and street maintenance. As one highly placed P.E.
told me..."Pretty soon with GPS, we won't need ANY monuments anymore!"

Even with the laws in place, and intergovernmetal agreements quoting
that law, right of way monuments, (both centerline and side line) are
going away with roadway re-construction.

We all know it's happening, and in this economic climate no one wants
to "rock the boat".... while more and more monuments disappear.

Guess it's a future money maker for those that will have to "re-create
the wheel" so to speak.

Like the man says... "pay me a little now,
or a LOT later", either way.....

I am not sure which state you are in but around here whoever destroyed the monuments is responsible for replacing them. Perhaps a call to the utilty company is in order? A very similar thing happened to me last year and I called them up and they were completely unaware: 1) that they existed 2) that there was a statute protecting them 3) they were responsible for them.

Long story short, They hired us to replace the monuments and now they know the law. Most of the time the guys digging the line can care less about monuments, however if you can get in touch with someone actually responsible good things can come of it.

Same issue with fencing outfits. Around here it's a misdemeanor, but they typically claim ignorance.

If only words stopped the Destruction of Street Monuments

WAC 332-120-040
(1) All land boundary survey monuments that are removed or destroyed shall be replaced or witness monuments shall be set to perpetuate the survey point.

RCW 58.24.040
(8) Permit the temporary removal or destruction of any section corner or any other land boundary mark or monument by any person, corporation, association, department, or subdivision of the state, county, or municipality as may be necessary or desirable to accommodate construction, mining, and other development of any land: PROVIDED, That such section corner or other land boundary mark or monument shall be referenced to the Washington Coordinate System by a registered professional engineer or land surveyor prior to such removal or destruction, and shall be replaced or a suitable reference monument established by a registered professional engineer or land surveyor within a reasonable time after completion of such construction, mining, or other development: AND PROVIDED FURTHER, That the department of natural resources shall adopt and promulgate reasonable rules and regulations under which the agency shall authorize such temporary removal or destruction and require the replacement of such section corner or other land boundary marks or monuments.

What do you mean by setting monuments in the curb-line exactly? Could you be more specific about this? I really like the idea because the only summer I was working on a large subdivision with dozens of lots of a quite a bit of construction I really felt the futility of setting rebar and caps in spots you just knew were more than likely going to get disturbed. Are you just drilling a hole with a hammer drill through the concrete and grouting in a rebar or something along those lines?