I'm finding that my existing AutoCAD 2000 w/LDD its PNEZD point database is ill equipped to handle the amount of descriptive data that a modern DC can collect for a single point (multiple codes, attributes, strings, and notes). I can get the info into the drawing by customizing the output from TopSurv to cram all of the codes, attributes, etc into the description as in this:
1661,12595.537,5785.199,1045.791,SMH$Depth=$Size=$Pipe Count=$Pipe Size=
1662,12575.469,5778.552,1041.906,IPF
1663,12673.189,5852.828,1053.901,CB$Depth=2.8#PIPE$Size=18
This is a ugly solution that results in a drawing cluttered by massive descriptions. Also, this is a one way solution that does not allow me to export the info back to TopSurv without losing all but the first code and attributes.
I would like some real world feed back from those of you who use TopSurv with either Carlson or C3D as to how well they handle all of the additional info. For example, when you import points containing multiple codes & attributes, how does the software keep up with and display this info? Also, does your software have the ability to export a coordinate file that can be imported back into TopSurv without losing descriptive info?
Ideally I'd like to be able to take the TopSurv .tsj file and import directly into the CAD software and have an interactive database of points that the software is aware of and can manipulate if necessary.
Hi Stephen:
I'm not sure if this will help or not, but we tried Topsurv 8 and couldn't make it work as-is with our C3D coding system. We found that wildcards cut off the notes when sending from cad to Topsurv, and multiple coding the way they want it was not efficient with our current system (we needed to add wildcard command codes that are a no-no in the topsurv codes system).
We tried the notes thing (on your recommendation as I recall). It worked much better, but we were unable to make it work as efficiently as it did before for our coding system (the jump to previously entered code feature was gone, and the wildcard export thing already mentioned). In the end, we had to have our dealer reload our old software version (7.5 or some such).
Our hope is that enough people will complain that when 8.2 comes out, they will have revamped their "Codes" idea to make it work efficiently with 3rd party linework coding systems. While I'm here, I should add that I see alot of potential in the codes thing, but it just doesn't seem to incorporate 3rd party systems (at least not ours). I'd also like them to have it all in one screen (not make you jump around to other screens for multiple codes and linework commands).
My guess is that the folks who designed it in the first place never took it into the field and tried to get 1000 shots in a day with it, while entering multiple codes for each point (something we could do quite easily before the "upgrade").
Of course, I'm guessing that you know more about all this than we do, since we gave up on it, but thought I'd give you my two cents.
Paul
I too have gotten frustrated with the process required to enter multiple codes w/attributes. I counted earlier and it takes 6 taps minimum to add a second code. All they needed to do was program the software to assume that any groups of characters separated by a specified delimiter are separate codes. In cases where the codes entered require strings or attributes, they could prompt for them on a single screen after taking the shot but before storing it.
I like the promise of what you can do with Topsurv and their implementation of codes, attributes etc. but if you can't get the info back and forth to your software of choice in a simple and foolproof manner it is useless. I have looked at the manuals for Carlson's SurvCE and they seem to have a similar system of codes,string,attributes etc. - not sure if theirs is any easier to import/export to.
For now, I'm stuck with what I currently own, but I want to be ready to make an educated decision when the time comes.
Carlson Survey works well here...
... I think. Contact their tech support department directly. They are very helpful.
I am a brand new user, but I think you can simply import a txt file with all those fancy codes you use,
then it will only show the base code in the cadd dwg,
but you can still simply click on the Carlson point and see BOTH the fancy code AND the clean cadd code too.
And you should be able to import / export those codes any way you like.
I hope this helps???
I'm not familiar with TopSurv but I'm pretty sure that I can see how to deal with this in Civil 3D. If you can you provide a larger sample file then I'll try to look at it later in the week.
Steve - I appreciate the offer, but I'm actually more interested in understanding how C3D prefers to handle coordinate files. The file that I originally posted is bastardized to force all of the description info into a single field. Topsurv's native format is a .tsj file which contains everything (pics, raw data, coordinates, etc) but I doubt that anything other than a Topcon CAD package will handle the native format. Normally when I export a coordinate file I get the normal PNEZD comma delimited format. The problem comes in when I add multiple codes per point. Topsurv delimits the additional codes with commas. So you end up with a data file where the number of data fields varies from row to row dependent upon the number of codes assigned to that particular point.
If the software has the ability to handle data files with varying number of fields per row then it will work great, if not I'll have to force it into submission like I'm currently doing with LDD.
> Steve - I appreciate the offer, but I'm actually more interested in understanding how C3D prefers to handle coordinate files.
The software doesn't really have a preference; it is all about how you choose to set up your import/export formats, point coding systems, labeling styles, etc.
Civil 3D can read a Raw Description with up to 9 attributes added to it. Attributes are separated from the description and from each other with a space character. They can include pretty much any combination of letters or numbers. When points are created the software can use the Raw Description and the attributes to create the Full Description. This is the description that you would use to label the point in the drawing. Attributes can also be used to control the scale and rotation of the point symbol.
In this example the data includes the Point#,North,East,Elev,Raw Description
The attributes for the Raw Desc include the bearing of the curb line at the CB, the depth, pipe size, and the azimuth of the lead. The IP code doesn't come with any attributes.
1,1041.123,865.387,46.140,CB 130 2.8 12 55
2,922.234,351.700,24.100,IPF
I can use the curb bearing to set the CB symbol rotation, and I can use any of the attributes as part of the Full Description. The attributes are optional, but they have to be supplied in order if you want the program to make use of them.
The other method for dealing with your data would be with User Defined Point Properties. In that scenario your csv files would need to include a specific column for each field that you intend to have. I'm pretty sure that you would have to open the file exported from TopSurv in Excel and move your attributes into the appropriate columns for each data type. When you save that file Excel will add commas to fill in the blank fields so that Civil3D sees the expected number of columns on import.
The advantage here is that each field is separate, and can be placed in a multi-line point label exactly how you want it organized. You can also create as many fields as you want, and only use the ones you want for each individual point.
Steve - Thank you, that was exactly the sort of info I was looking for.
