Notifications
Clear all

Brain teaser

73 Posts
13 Users
0 Reactions
511 Views
dave-lindell
(@dave-lindell)
Posts: 1684
Supporter
Topic starter
 

What is the smallest positive integer, y, that makes 1729y?ý+1 equal a perfect square?

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 4:38 pm
mathteacher
(@mathteacher)
Posts: 2097
Member
 

35

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 5:00 pm
bill93
(@bill93)
Posts: 9880
Member Debater
 
Posted by: @mathteacher

Is there a way to solve this other than trying each value? Properties of integers is not one of my strong suits.

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 5:10 pm
bill93
(@bill93)
Posts: 9880
Member Debater
 
Posted by: @mathteacher

35

You forgot the squaring of y.

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 5:17 pm
bill93
(@bill93)
Posts: 9880
Member Debater
 
Posted by: @dave-lindell

My spreadsheet says 2954 is close.?ÿ Nope.?ÿ It isn't an integer solution.

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 5:39 pm

mike-marks
(@mike-marks)
Posts: 1125
Member
 

That is a very difficult problem and forms the basis of some Internet encryption.?ÿ The solution could be in the tens of billons if y > (a big number).?ÿ I poked around and could find no easy way to solve it.?ÿ I suspect your problem is a teaser and is unsolvable without big iron supercomputers.

If someone pops up with the solution I'll be mightily impressed.

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 6:30 pm
holy-cow
(@holy-cow)
Posts: 25373
Supporter Debater
 

@bill93

The square root of the sum of 1 and 1729 x 2954 x 2954 is 122831 exactly

There may be a smaller answer, though.

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 6:30 pm
bill93
(@bill93)
Posts: 9880
Member Debater
 
Posted by: @holy-cow

Nope.?ÿ It works to the precision of my calculator, but the expression yields 15087454565 and 122831^2 is 15087454561.

You can see that it doesn't work just by keeping only last digits in your head as you work through it, and not worrying about the rest of the big product digits.

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 6:47 pm
holy-cow
(@holy-cow)
Posts: 25373
Supporter Debater
 

@bill93

I agree.?ÿ I goofed.

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 7:14 pm
mike-marks
(@mike-marks)
Posts: 1125
Member
 

After additional research I found that

1729ƒ???úƒ??2668122?ÿ+ 1

is prime so the problem reduces to y2 = 2^ 668122 to solve for y which is no trivial task.?ÿ I'm convinced it's an even number though because of the +1 factor.

?ÿ

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 7:25 pm

mike-marks
(@mike-marks)
Posts: 1125
Member
 

@holy-cow Nope, I get 122831.00001628253453824718136713 which is well within the accuracy of my crappy 64 bit calculator so y is not = 2954.

Plenty good enough for setting a monument though and I'd be miffed if you pincushioned?ÿ my mon 0.00001' next to it.

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 7:34 pm
bill93
(@bill93)
Posts: 9880
Member Debater
 
Posted by: @mike-marks

You totally lost me on how you got there from the initial problem posted.

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 7:50 pm
spmpls
(@spmpls)
Posts: 660
Member
 

The answer is obviously Pi. Pi is the answer to almost all things. If not, it's Avogadro's number: 6.02 x 10 to the 23rd.

If I ever need to solve the problem the OP presented as a matter of land surveying, I shall turn in my license. I am confident my license is not at risk.

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 8:48 pm
holy-cow
(@holy-cow)
Posts: 25373
Supporter Debater
 

Ignore The Hitchhiker.................it ain't 42.............

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 10:16 pm
john-nolton
(@john-nolton)
Posts: 563
Member
 

I get the same number as the MathTeacher?ÿ "35"

JOHN NOLTON

 
Posted : February 23, 2021 11:32 pm

Bugg
 Bugg
(@bugg)
Posts: 22
Member
 

If y=0 isnt ok then

y=1729*13!?ÿ which is the integer 10766518963200

The side of the square is then?ÿ 447685271124001

?ÿ

not so small?ÿ ?????ÿ

 
Posted : February 24, 2021 6:34 am
mathteacher
(@mathteacher)
Posts: 2097
Member
 

Not quite. That number is actually 447685271124000.969078681, truncated at 9 decimal places.

This site may have enough capacity to find the answer, or it may not:?ÿ https://www.mathsisfun.com/calculator-precision.html

?ÿ

 
Posted : February 24, 2021 6:58 am
mathteacher
(@mathteacher)
Posts: 2097
Member
 

@bill93

Not mine, either. I'd be a bad choice for a crypto job.

 
Posted : February 24, 2021 7:03 am
bill93
(@bill93)
Posts: 9880
Member Debater
 
Posted by: @john-nolton

Only if you leave off the squaring of y.

 
Posted : February 24, 2021 7:24 am
mathteacher
(@mathteacher)
Posts: 2097
Member
 

@mike-marks

The square root of 2^668122 is just 2^334061; take half the exponent. But, we want 1729*y^2+1 to be a perfect square and your y produces a prime number for that expression, which can't be a perfect square.

 
Posted : February 24, 2021 7:30 am

Page 1 / 4