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(@mightymoe)
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Doing laps in Concourse B at the Denver airport and there are a few of these billboards.?ÿ

I had to take a picture.

To the billboard creators.........those words don't mean what you think they mean.

Civility
 
Posted : August 16, 2022 8:03 am
(@norman-oklahoma)
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You'll get Tommy Young all riled up...

 
Posted : August 16, 2022 8:25 am
(@holy-cow)
Posts: 25292
 

A major source of their income is the Anschutz Foundation.?ÿ He was a Kansas boy who got lucky on some oil investments and invested wisely throughout his lifetime.?ÿ His oil interests stretched over at least four states and other money went into ranching on a large scale.

I think a couple of his relatives were fellow students with me in the same department at KSU.

 
Posted : August 16, 2022 8:34 am
(@holy-cow)
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I had family on both sides of that extended period of hostilities.

 
Posted : August 16, 2022 8:36 am
(@dougie)
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GIF
 
Posted : August 16, 2022 10:00 am
(@mightymoe)
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Makes me wonder what a history class would teach these days.?ÿ

 
Posted : August 16, 2022 11:02 am
(@dougie)
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GIF
 
Posted : August 16, 2022 11:50 am
(@holy-cow)
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That's an oxymoron.

 
Posted : August 16, 2022 12:17 pm
(@mightymoe)
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civil war, pretty ugly, accurate estimate, original copy.

 
Posted : August 16, 2022 1:06 pm
(@rj-schneider)
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Posted by: @mightymoe

To the billboard creators.........those words don't mean what you think they mean.

oh .. I'd say run it by those folks whose flight was delayed for six hours, or any of the other fun things the airlines do to you.

PlanesTrainsAutomobiles
 
Posted : August 16, 2022 5:09 pm
(@james-fleming)
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There wasn't much "common ground" in the "house divided speech"

 
Posted : August 17, 2022 5:54 am
(@rover83)
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Posted by: @mightymoe

Makes me wonder what a history class would teach these days.?ÿ

According the half dozen or so of my family members who are teachers, they'd teach the facts of historical events, contemporary societal impacts, implications for the future, how those events shaped the present we live in, and the lessons we can take away from those events....

...until a small subset of parents decide that the facts, and lessons, didn't line up too well with whatever fever-dream make-believe alternate reality they cooked up in their head. Or were taught by their equally ignorant parents.

?ÿ

My first degree was in history. I am actually glad I didn't go into teaching because I wouldn't be able to handle the intrusion of politics and revisionism into the historical record. Universities are at least a bit less susceptible to it, but not everyone gets to a university - or takes history courses when they get there.

 
Posted : August 17, 2022 6:04 am
(@holy-cow)
Posts: 25292
 

It seems everyone wants to rewrite history.?ÿ I think that is largely because what we have heard, seen and read over the decades is what we view to be true.?ÿ Those who have heard, seen and read different things believe those other things to be true.?ÿ Truth is not an absolute.

Those who have grown up being exposed to bondage ( leash laws, zoning, homeowner associations, sanitation codes, vaccination prior to school enrollment, fees for virtually everything, setback requirements, mother-may-I's of every sort) view the world differently from those who have never had to deal with such matters.?ÿ It's called FREEDOM.

I have found it interesting that one of my great-great grandfathers spent about four years walking all over nearly every southern state you can name while supporting the Union.?ÿ He was a native of New York, living in Illinois in 1861.?ÿ He came to Kansas in the 1870's.?ÿ Here, one of his neighbors was a family who settled here after leaving Georgia after the war.?ÿ His daughter married the neighbor's son.?ÿ How about that??ÿ You would have expected it to be more like the Hatfield's and the McCoy's.

 
Posted : August 17, 2022 8:39 am
(@lurker)
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@holy-cow I'm curious, where are these people "who never had to deal with such matters". Do they exist somewhere outside of society in some type of isolation? Everyone I'm aware of has had to deal with the constraints of living amongst other people. I wouldn't describe them as living in bondage though.?ÿ

Then again maybe there exists such a place that I am unaware of.

 
Posted : August 17, 2022 8:53 am
(@flga-2-2-2-2-2-2-2-2)
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I don't give a ats rass who does what, by the the time y'all decide to kill each other (for the second time) I'll hopefully be croaked, good luck, yer gonna need it. ?????ÿ

 
Posted : August 17, 2022 9:08 am
(@holy-cow)
Posts: 25292
 

@lurker?ÿ

Relatively speaking it is bondage versus freedom.

My home county is not zoned.?ÿ There are no leash laws, homeowner associations, etc. to worry about.?ÿ I can even hunt on my own property without acquiring a hunting license.?ÿ Same for fishing.?ÿ I can burn trash in my back yard if I so choose.?ÿ I can target shoot on my own property.?ÿ If I decide to construct a small pond, I can do that with no mother-may-I's involved.?ÿ I can play my stereo as loudly as I choose at all hours of the day or night and my neighbors are free to do the same.?ÿ I can yell at the cats without someone calling the ASPCA.?ÿ My grandkids are free to roam as they please without some do-gooder attempting to claim child endangerment against me.

Compare that to living where everything around you is controlled by others attempting to save you from yourself so long as you follow what THEY decide is best for you.

?ÿ

 
Posted : August 17, 2022 9:22 am
(@rover83)
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Posted by: @holy-cow

Those who have grown up being exposed to bondage ( leash laws, zoning, homeowner associations, sanitation codes, vaccination prior to school enrollment, fees for virtually everything, setback requirements, mother-may-I's of every sort) view the world differently from those who have never had to deal with such matters.?ÿ It's called FREEDOM.

Everyone who has existed in a community of any sort for the past century has lived within a rule system, whether promulgated in law or tacitly agreed upon, and enforced, by members of the community. Or yes, set out by a neighborhood association. The notion that "everything restrictive in any way is inherently negative because I can't do what I want at any time" doesn't track in any functioning society.

The various levels of balance between personal rights and community goals, what those goals are (or were being attempted), and how they impacted events (and vice versa), is a big part of history. Historians make huge efforts to begin from a non-judgmental, non-ideological position. This tends to cause problems for folks who want to begin from a particular ideology or worldview and force history to fit.

The other problem is that events, and especially the people that defined them, are often not black or white. A big part of history curricula, especially at the university level, is exploring the impacts without making a blanket judgment - and taking away lessons that can be applied to the present without regard to the very specific (and by definition myopic) circumstances under which we grew up.

There were some "heroes of history" who also did some pretty awful things, and some of the villains of the past weren't totally villainous in all aspects of their lives. Same thing with events, case in point the USA Civil War. There was a lot of awful and great results of that event. Reducing it to a single perspective is the antithesis of historical analysis.

 
Posted : August 17, 2022 9:40 am
(@bill93)
Posts: 9834
 
Posted by: @holy-cow

Truth is not an absolute.

The truth of what happened in the past is absolute but not always knowable. Each detail either did or did not happen. We may attempt to discern the past by proper study of evidence in order to obtain a good approximation to the truth.The evidence is not always clear, so we don't learn the truth of every event.

The motives and relative priorities of the actors can only be inferred by others, and may be ambiguous even to the actors themselves.

What is good and bad is an evaluation by observers according to their background and knowledge, therefore differing, and usually a careful look will find tradeoffs.

?ÿ

 
Posted : August 17, 2022 10:57 am
(@holy-cow)
Posts: 25292
 

@rover83?ÿ

If WW II had not happened, my father would have never met my mother, so I would not be here.?ÿ Good thing or bad thing.?ÿ Your choice.

 
Posted : August 17, 2022 11:50 am
(@holy-cow)
Posts: 25292
 

@bill93?ÿ

Our Senior English teacher in high school introduced us to philosophy one day by focusing on "Who are you?"?ÿ What she was driving at is that each of us are known by others based on what they happen to know about us.?ÿ Thus, there is an unlimited number of versions as to who I am.

 
Posted : August 17, 2022 11:53 am
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