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Utility Locate Law

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TJE Yogi
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A Law RCW 19.122 was passed in Washington State saying a locate is required
for any ground disturbance, pounding a property corner, hub, nail etc.
Our Survey Society is wondering how this happened and why weren't we advised in the process as stake holders. Apparantly most states have new regulations regarding this issue.
Was NSPS involved?

What are other states doing about this or have you read the fine print in your state?
We have a few surveyors here who are looking into it. They came to our meeting with this shocking information.


 
Posted : January 13, 2013 9:56 pm
spledeus
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Page 12, Dig Safe, Dig Safely

I wrote the article a few years ago after puncturing a gas service located where a bound was supposed to be. It would appear that the construction company wiped out the bound when they installed the gas.

After being fined and charged for the accident and repair, I contacted the Division of Public Utilities and discovered that the interpretation in the law had changed. We have a Dig Safe Law requiring any excavation requires a utility markout. We had tried to use this service in the past and the Dig Safe folks refused to mark for planning purposes.


 
Posted : January 13, 2013 10:27 pm
The Pseudo Ranger
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So are they now willing to mark for surveyors? In Florida, when those laws were instituted, surveyors called relentlessly to get markups on every job, then they eventually excluded us, and gave us clearance to dig up to 18".


 
Posted : January 14, 2013 8:07 am
CHarmon
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They've been requiring that in Ohio for I don't know how long. It's been long enough I've forgot when they started. I don't think any input was asked for by Surveyors, if it was it was real quick and just to check the box. I've finally started getting markings after fighting with them for years. They started by wanting the corners painted up before hand. I would just put a white flagged stake in and tell them to give me 20' around each point. They just started marking up the whole site like I asked for. If construction picks back up I have a feeling I'll be ignored again.

After driving a pin through a traffic signal wire (not me but another crew 2 yrs before I got to the company) I found no easement in the area so our lawyer told me to tell the city to go pound sand. I did and never heard another word about it. Figured we'd get in trouble because no OUPS ticket was submitted but nothing ever came from it.


 
Posted : January 14, 2013 8:26 am
jud
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It should be the responsibility of all who place any utility underground to provide a map that is assessable for all to review. That map should have the depth and position shown close enough to be able to determine if there is a danger of hitting the utility. Calling for a locate, waiting for it for several days is a cost that could be avoided if maps were available, not checking the maps would justify being liable for damage. Call before you dig sounds good to many, but it is just a way for utility companies to avoid their responsibility to the public to map their property and to pass that responsibility on to others who have nothing to do with utilities. Poor public policy, call before you dig should only be required after checking utility maps and finding some proximity problems. After checking utility maps and finding no conflict and then being required to call should not be required by State Law and if damage to unmapped utility locations does happen, the utility company should be liable for any damage and any lost work or damages caused to others because of their failure to properly map their system. The American people should never have allowed such a thing as Call Before You Dig become State Law. Maybe in dense population centers there could be justification for such a law, but it should be a local requirement only, just because people dwell in population centers does not give them the right to impose their needs over those who do not have their problems, the mapping should be a State requirement, not the Call Before You Dig.
jud


 
Posted : January 14, 2013 10:19 am

Dallas
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Getting locates in Ohio has been a pain going back to the early 1980s. A few years ago Ohio Utilities Protection Service (OUPS) was scheduled to make a presentation at a Central Ohio Professional Land Surveyors chapter meeting. We set quietly through the presentation then began asking questions. Naturally one of the questions was about getting locates for boundary surveys. The standard response of planning surveys not requiring locates was given. Next question was what if we hit a utility with a corner pin or monument. Again the standard answer that assumed such activity would not require site marking.

At that point I pull a standard 30 inch Berntsen driven rod monument from under my chair and said you mean driving this will not be a problem? The look on the speakers face was priceless and the response was "Do all of you set corners like THAT?" We explained that Ohio minimum standards require a 30 inch minimum length and 1/2 inch cross section iron or magnetic detectable monument. Response was "Yes you should be getting locates before you drive those." Our next question was regarding excavating for existing monuments. Now the response was a question "How deep do you dig?" Several recounted digging 3 to 4 feet to recover old corners covered with recent fill. Next question from the OUPS speaker was "How do you know when to stop digging?" Answer was "When we see what is setting off the metal detector! No way to know in advance if we will dig 3 inches or 3 feet!"

Speaker was shocked at the level of misinformation OPUS had been working with and promised that policies would be revised. I believe it was shortly after that OUPS began being more responsive to surveyor requests.


 
Posted : January 14, 2013 1:13 pm
spledeus
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We worked on a drainage project for a mile of road. Retrofit, simple enough. We contacted the gas company for the gas maps. The gas man would not release the maps for fear of terrorism! Really?
We still joke around in the office about the terrorist who calls for a dig safe so they could blow up a 4" gas main.


 
Posted : January 14, 2013 1:23 pm
jud
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Should only be required to call for a locate when, the not now required publicity available underground utility maps, show that utility's are a factor. If they hide it, they need to map it, if unwilling to do so, they need to take full responsibility for any damage to their property from any normal activity's that may take place. It is in the public's interest to place the burden on the owners of underground utility s to provide map locations for the safety of the public by enabling the public access to one source location maps. Time for the public to stop allowing special interests to pass their responsibility's on to others without some requirements to protect themselves in place.
jud


 
Posted : January 14, 2013 1:35 pm
Dallas
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> Should only be required to call for a locate when, the not now required publicity available underground utility maps, show that utility's are a factor. If they hide it, they need to map it, if unwilling to do so, they need to take full responsibility for any damage to their property from any normal activity's that may take place. It is in the public's interest to place the burden on the owners of underground utility s to provide map locations for the safety of the public by enabling the public access to one source location maps. Time for the public to stop allowing special interests to pass their responsibility's on to others without some requirements to protect themselves in place.
> jud

I don't disagree with much of what you say jud. However, I have years of experience with actual locates of excavated utilities versus the utility maps. I worked as a contractor surveying and documenting new telephone easements on private property 30 years ago. Telephone right-of-way agent we worked for was one of the few that had training to understand what we were doing was better than the in house services he had available.

I would not subject my crew to trusting utility maps for field work. Most are less accurate than field note sketches. The maps have no dimensions or only offsets from edge of pavement. If a pavement has been widened or alignment changed in the last 20 or 30 years the utility maps are often useless.

I regard to prior comment "We still joke around in the office about the terrorist who calls for a dig safe so they could blow up a 4" gas main. "Don't think in terms of one line. Think in terms of 20 widely separate locations going up at the same time. Just a single line blasted so gas leaks into a sewer may take hours to trace and create a huge hazard. Just review this story of the 1992 Guadalajara explosions where gasoline was involved. Natural gas could be as serious.


 
Posted : January 14, 2013 2:53 pm
eapls2708
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> Our Survey Society is wondering how this happened and why weren't we advised in the process as stake holders. Apparantly most states have new regulations regarding this issue.

The CLSA has a law firm (lobbyists) in Sacramento who keeps an eye on all pending legislation and notifies the CLSA Legislative Committee of any legislation containing provisions that may be of interest to surveyors. Our consultant has very good legislative and industry contacts and is often aware of plans to introduce legislation originating from different industry groups and which legislator(s) they are working with to introduce it.

If LSAW doesn't have such a consultant on the books, they should probably get one. CLSA has been able to head off quite a bit of bad legislation because of our lobby consultant's work for us.


 
Posted : January 15, 2013 5:02 pm