Way way back in the early years of this millenium, while employed by a major GPS manfacturing company, I sat in on many meetings with what were then recent college graduates (mostly marketing and sales people, fairly fresh out of college). I took meeting notes, and wrote them in cursive because it's much faster to write on a paper notepad. I was trained as a draftsman by my father, and my freehand has occasionally been mistaken by some as a computer font. Not saying that my hand is that good, just saying how these young people did not understand or comprehend cursive writing as it should be done. I grew up reading the beautiful flowing cursive of surveyor's field notes from original GLO surveys of the back country in my home state. Along with my Dad's appreciation for clear writing and drafting by hand, (no sense writing it if no one can read it) I took something from that.
One particular protege, a young and very bright woman who had recently graduated from a state university in California in the field of "geomatics", saw my notes and asked me what language I was writing in. She had never seen cursive before, she thought it was some kind of calligraphy (a word which by chance, she had somehow heard of). She told me that no high schools in California teach cursive writing. This was in the year 2000.
I have a 22-year old nephew who is very canny and smart, a great kid, an industrial design major in college, but cannot express himself with pencil/pen or paper, because the only thing he has ever used to express himself is a computer keyboard and the click and drag of a mouse. He cannot spell or write properly in English, but is a straight-A student. He mostly communicates with me in terms of LOLs or WTFs or OMGs or JaJaJas (his native language is Spanish).
The times they are a changin'.
Sign of the times... Loyal .....
The topic of juniors not being able to read cursive handwriting was raised here in media towards end of last year.
Absolutely incredible as teachers are saying too much to teach. Seems a tad ironic , given that there is little cursive writing!
RADU
Sign of the times
I now see that taking 7th Grade typing was worth more than the fact that there were a lot of pretty girls in the class.
Sign of the times
after the last 30+ years of watching people struggle with the QWERTY keyboard, I now realize that the typing class I took in from Mrs Latimer in 1970 was the best knowledge I ever gained from my high school years. Even though she slept through most of it.
i just typed this post with all of my fingers, not just the one finger on either hand.
Only had to hit backspace twice.
😛
B
Sign of the times
The other cool thing about the typing class, other than the classmates, was that Mrs. Droege let us bring our favorite records to school and the office would play them over the intercom while we typed. She said it helped our typing rhythm but it helped her popularity way more. Rolling Stones, Dave Clark Five, etc., cute girls, 13 years old? Cool class.
Not sure why cursive is important
I have to say that I find this thread amusing. I was taught cursive as a child, handwriting was the only class I struggled with until high school, but I only print now. I guess I do not understand the value of being able to write in cursive, someone mentioned calligraphy and it seems to me that this is the way that cursive is going, a pretty and effective form of writing that is becoming outdated.
On the subject of being able to read cursive, I believe that the ability to read field notes or old deeds, as is the case here in the NE, is a skill that is attained and honed and has little to do with having been taught cursive or not. Being able to read a deed written in 1790 is about much more than being able to read cursive, it is about understanding the vernacular and the form of the document in order to completely understand it.
I guess this thread, at least to me, sounds like a bunch of grumpy old men talking about how much better things were back then and how these young kids are ruining everything. But then again, without treads consisting mainly of moaning about how things have changed this forum would not nearly be as busy. 😉
Not sure why cursive is important
:good: Lol! my 6yo displays greater ease/skill on a computer than I did in my late 20's. I would take that skillset head & shoulders over an outdated form of handwriting as being more pertinent to one's future success.
Knowledge and curiosity and vice versa
Our 8 yr old is very computer savvy also. He has had computers in his classroom beginning at pre-k.
Now in the 2nd grade, he is learning powerpoint and he can navigate around any hardware from a I-touch to a desk top.
He does not own a DS or GameBoy like a lot of 8 year old kids do these days.
He likes his Wii games Some of them like the Lego ones do have a lot of analytical thinking built into them besides the fun of blowing things up and kicking butt of the enemies etc.
But I asked him this morning if he was learning cursive in school and he said no. He did say that this teacher was going to "start on it" at school soon.
He has an interest in cursive and he writes his name in cursive etc.
To him, it is interesting like a form of cryptography and writing as an art form with all the circles and loops. I asked if he wanted to start learning it at home and he said yes in a very positive manner. So we will start because his interest and curiosity is established. Last Summer, We used the World Cup to learn world geography and he did excel.
He learned a lot and also had to keep the bracket stats of points, goals for and against etc.When thee subject of world geography was touched upon this year in 2nd grade he excelled. he could also tell you the strikers from Cameroon, Cote d'Ivorie, Slovenia, Slovakia etc.
Yesterday, we got a letter from school in his take home folder requesting permission to test him for gifted classes. His reading level is at top of his class and his favorite subject is math.
We started playing 'hangman' recently at night before bed just using a pencil and paper. He is good. We can introduce the cursive writing into our nightly ritual also.
I also stuffed his stocking with a couple of beginner KenKen books at Christmas and he is very interested in them also.
My mother and father also knew how to write in shorthand(Gregg style?). Mom was an executive secretary during WW2 with B-D in NJ. They did R&D and made surgical instruments for the war effort. My father ran the records bureau of the city police department for a few years in the 50's.
Talk about a lost art...
My father was always interested in cryptography and would like to solve the puzzles in the newspapers or books with ease.
Knowledge and curiosity and vice versa
I certainly wouldn't argue against the teaching of cursive writing in school - guess I just acquiese to the vastly diminished importance of it as a necessary skill set for the american school-going public, and if something had to be cut from a curriculum, there you go. As it is, my cursive was & is a bastardized conglomeration of the occasional print character in with the cursive, particularly at the start of a word / capital letter. Being accomplished in writing it doesn't necessarily relate to how well one would be able to read it IMO.
Knowledge and curiosity and vice versa
I would note that I write in cursive nearly daily and I guess I am one of the few people left that write cursive letters to friends and relatives. It is a dying art which is a shame. An electron "letter" does not carry the intimate feel that a nice, hand written, letter carries. Challenge to you, write a nice, hand written letter, to your mother, father, aunt, or some other important person in your life. It may very well become a treasured and saved document.
> I still carry a fountain pen in my pocket. I use it, too.
Me Also.;-)
OK Keith.
The Cadastral Branch of the BLM in California no longer takes bearing trees. At least not in the contracts they are performing for the USFS in northern California.
The areas of which are heavily timbered. You can't spit without hitting a tree in this area.
Even more disturbing is they are doing a lot of work without setting 1/4 corners. Only section corners. Their arguement is that the 1/4 corners are work more needed by the private side. Somewhat true as most of the USFS lands are full sections around here. But it shouldn't be that way. The BLM "should" be surveying in to the 1/4 corner positions as part of their search for original GLO, so they "should" be visiting those positions anyways. However, they are not setting them, and I am beginning to question just how diligent they are in their searches for the 1/4 corners.
Unfortunately, the Calif BLM does not have their notes and plats electronically available so I can't readily send you a copy of one showing the lack of accessories and 1/4 corners. I can scan a set and send you a copy if you wish though. Let me know.
Sign of the times
> after the last 30+ years of watching people struggle with the QWERTY keyboard, I now realize that the typing class I took in from Mrs Latimer in 1970 was the best knowledge I ever gained from my high school years. Even though she slept through most of it.
>
> i just typed this post with all of my fingers, not just the one finger on either hand.
>
> Only had to hit backspace twice.
>
> 😛
>
> B
Funny. Mine was Mrs. Moore in 68-69. Came out typing 65 wpm and still nearly flunked.
The only class I really had to work at.
Not sure why cursive is important
> :good: Lol! my 6yo displays greater ease/skill on a computer than I did in my late 20's. I would take that skillset head & shoulders over an outdated form of handwriting as being more pertinent to one's future success.
In our line of work, if you can't read and understand the old hand written deeds you will not be able to be a complete surveyor.
Not sure why cursive is important
True. But the basic premise of this thread, a I took it, was that an inability to or lack of a desire to write in cursive has no bearing on you ability to read and understand deeds and field notes that are written in cursive.
Loyal...
at a recent happy hour there was a local elementary school teacher telling us that cursive/script may be discontinued in her juridiction's curriculum. change it to typing and hand printing only.
my very first suspicion was reading old deeds. always trying to look at things from my own angle.
as a side note, thanks for posting and keeping us up with topics like your recent htdp developments. i am doing my best to keep up, as well.. not to mention to COMPLETELY understand what it could mean to me in the future. your topics are some of the technically most interesting. there are many others, john h, gee odd, professor mugnier, bill 93, kent, etc. my apologies for the others i omitted. "rant" off
Loyal...
Thanks Eddie
Loyal...
This is some scary sh*t guys. I'm beginning to feel my age @ very near reptilian. But yet I know I can outrun most ovem when chased by a mountain lion. But who ever gets chased by a cat anymore? Somebody get me a tutor and inform me on how to use Twitter, Facebook etc. so I can survive present society. I fear I have nearly drowned, maybe I'll just take Zac Brown's advise and just "Let it Go". Hope you all had a good day "surveyin" today like I did.
Cheers,
Pablo
clearcut,
Do you have a name?
Post your information here if you want to?
There has to be more to the story!!
Keith;-)
I don't believe a word of this?
"The Cadastral Branch of the BLM in California no longer takes bearing trees. At least not in the contracts they are performing for the USFS in northern California.
The areas of which are heavily timbered. You can't spit without hitting a tree in this area.
Even more disturbing is they are doing a lot of work without setting 1/4 corners. Only section corners. Their arguement is that the 1/4 corners are work more needed by the private side. Somewhat true as most of the USFS lands are full sections around here. But it shouldn't be that way. The BLM "should" be surveying in to the 1/4 corner positions as part of their search for original GLO, so they "should" be visiting those positions anyways. However, they are not setting them, and I am beginning to question just how diligent they are in their searches for the 1/4 corners."
I want to see proof of this nonsense!
Keith